[JohnR34231]

I think there should be some reasonable level of expectations between accepting mediocrity (which pretty much defines the last few decades of Stanford football up to 2010) and thinking we should have a top ten team that makes it to a BCS bowl every year.

Obviously there is room for improvement on this years team. However, screaming and yelling because we are not 7-0 is a bit much, at least IMO.

[JohnR34231]

I think there should be some reasonable level of expectations between accepting mediocrity (which pretty much defines the last few decades of Stanford football up to 2010) and thinking we should have a top ten team that makes it to a BCS bowl every year.

Obviously there is room for improvement on this years team. However, screaming and yelling because we are not 7-0 is a bit much, at least IMO.

[JohnOlenchalk]

You don't have to scream and yell to point out wtf is going on with the offense, from playcalling, game management, personnel and execution to pissing away games we should win.  Especially on national tv.  It damages the brand.  I think it is worth yelling about when we see it going on, and on, and on.

[JohnOlenchalk]

You don't have to scream and yell to point out wtf is going on with the offense, from playcalling, game management, personnel and execution to pissing away games we should win.  Especially on national tv.  It damages the brand.  I think it is worth yelling about when we see it going on, and on, and on.

[JohnOlenchalk]

You don't have to scream and yell to point out wtf is going on with the offense, from playcalling, game management, personnel and execution to pissing away games we should win.  Especially on national tv.  It damages the brand.  I think it is worth yelling about when we see it going on, and on, and on.

[JohnOlenchalk]

You don't have to scream and yell to point out wtf is going on with the offense, from playcalling, game management, personnel and execution to pissing away games we should win.  Especially on national tv.  It damages the brand.  I think it is worth yelling about when we see it going on, and on, and on.

[fullmetal]

Who's holding Shaw accountable?

[fullmetal]

Who's holding Shaw accountable?

[fullmetal]

Who's holding Shaw accountable?

[fullmetal]

Who's holding Shaw accountable?

[Roberton3]

Who's holding Shaw accountable?

Why do you think he needs to be held accountable?  Do you think he doesn't want to win?  Get real.

And I'm sure that if there's a need to hold him accountable, the AD and major boosters (e.g., Arrillaga) will do so.

[Roberton3]

Who's holding Shaw accountable?

Why do you think he needs to be held accountable?  Do you think he doesn't want to win?  Get real.

And I'm sure that if there's a need to hold him accountable, the AD and major boosters (e.g., Arrillaga) will do so.

[Roberton3]

Who's holding Shaw accountable?

Why do you think he needs to be held accountable?  Do you think he doesn't want to win?  Get real.

And I'm sure that if there's a need to hold him accountable, the AD and major boosters (e.g., Arrillaga) will do so.

[Roberton3]

Who's holding Shaw accountable?

Why do you think he needs to be held accountable?  Do you think he doesn't want to win?  Get real.

And I'm sure that if there's a need to hold him accountable, the AD and major boosters (e.g., Arrillaga) will do so.

[fullmetal]

Shaw, just like everyone else holding a job, needs to be held accountable to do the best job he can with the resources he has.  There's debate over whether there is great fault to be found in Stanford's offense.  There is no debate whether there are small, easily fixable faults in the Stanford offense.  It's pretty reasonable to say that there are many reasons for which Shaw needs to be held accountable.

I think Shaw wants to coach the way he wants to coach regardless of his players' capabilities or his team's strengths.  I do think he is putting his own ego ahead of the possibility of this Stanford team being undefeated by retaining his chosen QB and running the kind of offensive plays that he wants to be run.  Nothing short of firing him would emasculate him more than having to replace Nunes--a clear admission of fundamental failure in his evaluation of the players.  No system or philosophy will thrive if the team's profile fails to fit the necessary strengths required to execute that system.

I fear that Shaw will stick with Nunes and sink the ship doing so.  Struggling against WSU is never a good sign.

[fullmetal]

Shaw, just like everyone else holding a job, needs to be held accountable to do the best job he can with the resources he has.  There's debate over whether there is great fault to be found in Stanford's offense.  There is no debate whether there are small, easily fixable faults in the Stanford offense.  It's pretty reasonable to say that there are many reasons for which Shaw needs to be held accountable.

I think Shaw wants to coach the way he wants to coach regardless of his players' capabilities or his team's strengths.  I do think he is putting his own ego ahead of the possibility of this Stanford team being undefeated by retaining his chosen QB and running the kind of offensive plays that he wants to be run.  Nothing short of firing him would emasculate him more than having to replace Nunes--a clear admission of fundamental failure in his evaluation of the players.  No system or philosophy will thrive if the team's profile fails to fit the necessary strengths required to execute that system.

I fear that Shaw will stick with Nunes and sink the ship doing so.  Struggling against WSU is never a good sign.

[fullmetal]

Shaw, just like everyone else holding a job, needs to be held accountable to do the best job he can with the resources he has.  There's debate over whether there is great fault to be found in Stanford's offense.  There is no debate whether there are small, easily fixable faults in the Stanford offense.  It's pretty reasonable to say that there are many reasons for which Shaw needs to be held accountable.

I think Shaw wants to coach the way he wants to coach regardless of his players' capabilities or his team's strengths.  I do think he is putting his own ego ahead of the possibility of this Stanford team being undefeated by retaining his chosen QB and running the kind of offensive plays that he wants to be run.  Nothing short of firing him would emasculate him more than having to replace Nunes--a clear admission of fundamental failure in his evaluation of the players.  No system or philosophy will thrive if the team's profile fails to fit the necessary strengths required to execute that system.

I fear that Shaw will stick with Nunes and sink the ship doing so.  Struggling against WSU is never a good sign.

[fullmetal]

Shaw, just like everyone else holding a job, needs to be held accountable to do the best job he can with the resources he has.  There's debate over whether there is great fault to be found in Stanford's offense.  There is no debate whether there are small, easily fixable faults in the Stanford offense.  It's pretty reasonable to say that there are many reasons for which Shaw needs to be held accountable.

I think Shaw wants to coach the way he wants to coach regardless of his players' capabilities or his team's strengths.  I do think he is putting his own ego ahead of the possibility of this Stanford team being undefeated by retaining his chosen QB and running the kind of offensive plays that he wants to be run.  Nothing short of firing him would emasculate him more than having to replace Nunes--a clear admission of fundamental failure in his evaluation of the players.  No system or philosophy will thrive if the team's profile fails to fit the necessary strengths required to execute that system.

I fear that Shaw will stick with Nunes and sink the ship doing so.  Struggling against WSU is never a good sign.

[fullmetal]

The athletic director would also hold Shaw accountable for things such as off-field transgressions by the team, academic performance of the team, and budgetary allocation of the team, so Shaw will not be held accountable only by his W-L record.

Now that garvin and Roberton have made it clear that donors shouldn't be holding Shaw accountable (I never mentioned that), I think the clear answer is that no one is going to provide objective feedback to the coaching staff about their performance.  Much as I'd hope the coaching staff keeps their heads in the game, there's been no evidence of offensive improvement through this season, and the coaching staff needs to make some changes lest they begin to resemble Einstein's definition of insanity.  It doesn't seem that anything will change however, as sub-.500 QB completion percentages, continued lack of sustained drives, and overall sloppy game play seem to be acceptable as long as the team doesn't lose *too* many games and as long as fans are reminded of the dark years.  It's not micromanaging to suggest that those areas of play need to be fixed.

With the season more than halfway over, quarterback Josh Nunes has shown little progress in his development. The wide receivers are hardly creating any separation, and a young offensive line is still plagued by inconsistency.

That's objective criticism from the AP story and not just Cardboard whinging.  I'll go down with this ship wherever it ends up, but first, a toast, to the season that could have been.

[fullmetal]

The athletic director would also hold Shaw accountable for things such as off-field transgressions by the team, academic performance of the team, and budgetary allocation of the team, so Shaw will not be held accountable only by his W-L record.

Now that garvin and Roberton have made it clear that donors shouldn't be holding Shaw accountable (I never mentioned that), I think the clear answer is that no one is going to provide objective feedback to the coaching staff about their performance.  Much as I'd hope the coaching staff keeps their heads in the game, there's been no evidence of offensive improvement through this season, and the coaching staff needs to make some changes lest they begin to resemble Einstein's definition of insanity.  It doesn't seem that anything will change however, as sub-.500 QB completion percentages, continued lack of sustained drives, and overall sloppy game play seem to be acceptable as long as the team doesn't lose *too* many games and as long as fans are reminded of the dark years.  It's not micromanaging to suggest that those areas of play need to be fixed.

With the season more than halfway over, quarterback Josh Nunes has shown little progress in his development. The wide receivers are hardly creating any separation, and a young offensive line is still plagued by inconsistency.

That's objective criticism from the AP story and not just Cardboard whinging.  I'll go down with this ship wherever it ends up, but first, a toast, to the season that could have been.

[fullmetal]

The athletic director would also hold Shaw accountable for things such as off-field transgressions by the team, academic performance of the team, and budgetary allocation of the team, so Shaw will not be held accountable only by his W-L record.

Now that garvin and Roberton have made it clear that donors shouldn't be holding Shaw accountable (I never mentioned that), I think the clear answer is that no one is going to provide objective feedback to the coaching staff about their performance.  Much as I'd hope the coaching staff keeps their heads in the game, there's been no evidence of offensive improvement through this season, and the coaching staff needs to make some changes lest they begin to resemble Einstein's definition of insanity.  It doesn't seem that anything will change however, as sub-.500 QB completion percentages, continued lack of sustained drives, and overall sloppy game play seem to be acceptable as long as the team doesn't lose *too* many games and as long as fans are reminded of the dark years.  It's not micromanaging to suggest that those areas of play need to be fixed.

With the season more than halfway over, quarterback Josh Nunes has shown little progress in his development. The wide receivers are hardly creating any separation, and a young offensive line is still plagued by inconsistency.

That's objective criticism from the AP story and not just Cardboard whinging.  I'll go down with this ship wherever it ends up, but first, a toast, to the season that could have been.

[fullmetal]

The athletic director would also hold Shaw accountable for things such as off-field transgressions by the team, academic performance of the team, and budgetary allocation of the team, so Shaw will not be held accountable only by his W-L record.

Now that garvin and Roberton have made it clear that donors shouldn't be holding Shaw accountable (I never mentioned that), I think the clear answer is that no one is going to provide objective feedback to the coaching staff about their performance.  Much as I'd hope the coaching staff keeps their heads in the game, there's been no evidence of offensive improvement through this season, and the coaching staff needs to make some changes lest they begin to resemble Einstein's definition of insanity.  It doesn't seem that anything will change however, as sub-.500 QB completion percentages, continued lack of sustained drives, and overall sloppy game play seem to be acceptable as long as the team doesn't lose *too* many games and as long as fans are reminded of the dark years.  It's not micromanaging to suggest that those areas of play need to be fixed.

With the season more than halfway over, quarterback Josh Nunes has shown little progress in his development. The wide receivers are hardly creating any separation, and a young offensive line is still plagued by inconsistency.

That's objective criticism from the AP story and not just Cardboard whinging.  I'll go down with this ship wherever it ends up, but first, a toast, to the season that could have been.

[JohnOlenchalk]

in Thunderdome (thebootboard).  It's long past insanity.  What's insane is nobody calls him out on this nonsense at the press briefings, and that we are supposed to take it on faith that Nunes is the best qb on the roster.

[JohnOlenchalk]

in Thunderdome (thebootboard).  It's long past insanity.  What's insane is nobody calls him out on this nonsense at the press briefings, and that we are supposed to take it on faith that Nunes is the best qb on the roster.

[JohnOlenchalk]

in Thunderdome (thebootboard).  It's long past insanity.  What's insane is nobody calls him out on this nonsense at the press briefings, and that we are supposed to take it on faith that Nunes is the best qb on the roster.

[JohnOlenchalk]

in Thunderdome (thebootboard).  It's long past insanity.  What's insane is nobody calls him out on this nonsense at the press briefings, and that we are supposed to take it on faith that Nunes is the best qb on the roster.

[fullmetal]

I'm not saying that Shaw needs to be fired.  I'm just saying that he needs to pay attention to and fix the obvious problems with this team's offense.

johnnyo and others who have been a part of Stanford athletic teams can probably testify to the fact that even Stanford coaches are only human and can make very human errors in judgment.

[fullmetal]

I'm not saying that Shaw needs to be fired.  I'm just saying that he needs to pay attention to and fix the obvious problems with this team's offense.

johnnyo and others who have been a part of Stanford athletic teams can probably testify to the fact that even Stanford coaches are only human and can make very human errors in judgment.

[fullmetal]

I'm not saying that Shaw needs to be fired.  I'm just saying that he needs to pay attention to and fix the obvious problems with this team's offense.

johnnyo and others who have been a part of Stanford athletic teams can probably testify to the fact that even Stanford coaches are only human and can make very human errors in judgment.

[fullmetal]

I'm not saying that Shaw needs to be fired.  I'm just saying that he needs to pay attention to and fix the obvious problems with this team's offense.

johnnyo and others who have been a part of Stanford athletic teams can probably testify to the fact that even Stanford coaches are only human and can make very human errors in judgment.

[dabigv13]

To be fair, Shaw really owes us as fans nothing. If he is convinced, beyond a doubt, that Nunes is the best QB on our roster, then it's hard to argue with what he's been doing. I don't think he owes it to us to put out Nottingham for a few series just to prove that Nottingham is garbage. And I wouldn't want him to do so.

But everything we knew going into this season seemed to indicate they were neck and neck, and in that case, I don't understand why we haven't tried to see if Nottingham has some magic in a bottle when it comes to gametime that Nunes clearly lacks. Maybe Nottingham is injured. Maybe he made a "yo mama" joke that rubbed Shaw the wrong way. Who knows at this point, and that information gap is why we're all in such a tizzy.

[dabigv13]

To be fair, Shaw really owes us as fans nothing. If he is convinced, beyond a doubt, that Nunes is the best QB on our roster, then it's hard to argue with what he's been doing. I don't think he owes it to us to put out Nottingham for a few series just to prove that Nottingham is garbage. And I wouldn't want him to do so.

But everything we knew going into this season seemed to indicate they were neck and neck, and in that case, I don't understand why we haven't tried to see if Nottingham has some magic in a bottle when it comes to gametime that Nunes clearly lacks. Maybe Nottingham is injured. Maybe he made a "yo mama" joke that rubbed Shaw the wrong way. Who knows at this point, and that information gap is why we're all in such a tizzy.

[dabigv13]

To be fair, Shaw really owes us as fans nothing. If he is convinced, beyond a doubt, that Nunes is the best QB on our roster, then it's hard to argue with what he's been doing. I don't think he owes it to us to put out Nottingham for a few series just to prove that Nottingham is garbage. And I wouldn't want him to do so.

But everything we knew going into this season seemed to indicate they were neck and neck, and in that case, I don't understand why we haven't tried to see if Nottingham has some magic in a bottle when it comes to gametime that Nunes clearly lacks. Maybe Nottingham is injured. Maybe he made a "yo mama" joke that rubbed Shaw the wrong way. Who knows at this point, and that information gap is why we're all in such a tizzy.

[dabigv13]

To be fair, Shaw really owes us as fans nothing. If he is convinced, beyond a doubt, that Nunes is the best QB on our roster, then it's hard to argue with what he's been doing. I don't think he owes it to us to put out Nottingham for a few series just to prove that Nottingham is garbage. And I wouldn't want him to do so.

But everything we knew going into this season seemed to indicate they were neck and neck, and in that case, I don't understand why we haven't tried to see if Nottingham has some magic in a bottle when it comes to gametime that Nunes clearly lacks. Maybe Nottingham is injured. Maybe he made a "yo mama" joke that rubbed Shaw the wrong way. Who knows at this point, and that information gap is why we're all in such a tizzy.

[fullmetal]

I'm not even asking for a QB switch.  I just want competent QB play, which includes: no more delay of game penalties (WSU was a good start), no more throwing behind receivers, and no more turnovers (close call).  Also, a +.500 completion percentage would be nice.  I don't care who the QB is, but that's what I would have expected out of a Stanford QB before the season--basic competency. 

In eerily similar season parallels, Texas had to throw a TD with 12 sec remaining to beat the powerhouse that is...Kansas.  Case McCoy threw that TD pass after replacing thus-far season-long starter David Ash.  http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/footbal...tml#recap  Texas also has a decent defense (they were great before injuries) and an inconsistent offense.

Well, at least we're not Maryland.
http://espn.go.com/blog/acc/post/_/id/47...aryland-qb

[fullmetal]

I'm not even asking for a QB switch.  I just want competent QB play, which includes: no more delay of game penalties (WSU was a good start), no more throwing behind receivers, and no more turnovers (close call).  Also, a +.500 completion percentage would be nice.  I don't care who the QB is, but that's what I would have expected out of a Stanford QB before the season--basic competency. 

In eerily similar season parallels, Texas had to throw a TD with 12 sec remaining to beat the powerhouse that is...Kansas.  Case McCoy threw that TD pass after replacing thus-far season-long starter David Ash.  http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/footbal...tml#recap  Texas also has a decent defense (they were great before injuries) and an inconsistent offense.

Well, at least we're not Maryland.
http://espn.go.com/blog/acc/post/_/id/47...aryland-qb

[fullmetal]

I'm not even asking for a QB switch.  I just want competent QB play, which includes: no more delay of game penalties (WSU was a good start), no more throwing behind receivers, and no more turnovers (close call).  Also, a +.500 completion percentage would be nice.  I don't care who the QB is, but that's what I would have expected out of a Stanford QB before the season--basic competency. 

In eerily similar season parallels, Texas had to throw a TD with 12 sec remaining to beat the powerhouse that is...Kansas.  Case McCoy threw that TD pass after replacing thus-far season-long starter David Ash.  http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/footbal...tml#recap  Texas also has a decent defense (they were great before injuries) and an inconsistent offense.

Well, at least we're not Maryland.
http://espn.go.com/blog/acc/post/_/id/47...aryland-qb

[fullmetal]

I'm not even asking for a QB switch.  I just want competent QB play, which includes: no more delay of game penalties (WSU was a good start), no more throwing behind receivers, and no more turnovers (close call).  Also, a +.500 completion percentage would be nice.  I don't care who the QB is, but that's what I would have expected out of a Stanford QB before the season--basic competency. 

In eerily similar season parallels, Texas had to throw a TD with 12 sec remaining to beat the powerhouse that is...Kansas.  Case McCoy threw that TD pass after replacing thus-far season-long starter David Ash.  http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/footbal...tml#recap  Texas also has a decent defense (they were great before injuries) and an inconsistent offense.

Well, at least we're not Maryland.
http://espn.go.com/blog/acc/post/_/id/47...aryland-qb

[SamAtoms1980]

Nottingham is a Capulet, and Shaw is a Montague.

That is the situation as described to me in a text message from the bard (OK, fine, it was a senior member of the band who'd had a jack-and-coke).

[SamAtoms1980]

Nottingham is a Capulet, and Shaw is a Montague.

That is the situation as described to me in a text message from the bard (OK, fine, it was a senior member of the band who'd had a jack-and-coke).