[Roberton3]

I'm not sure you can blame Baylor's system either. RGIII was legitimately great his first year in the league, and Griffin vs. Luck looked like a fun rivalry for the next decade or so. But there's never been any player so good they could survive the Dan Snyder stink.

I hate Dan Snyder and think he's a disaster as an owner, but I don't think you can blame this on him.  The problem is that QBs who rely heavily on running generally don't do well in the NFL.  If they run a lot, they're great, but tend to get hurt pretty quickly.  And turning them into pocket passers rarely works well.  RGIII falls right into that pattern.  He ran a lot his first season, which worked great until he got hurt.  If they'd kept doing that, he would just have gotten hurt again and again.  So they tried to turn him into a pocket passer, and sure enough, it didn't work.

[Roberton3]

I'm not sure you can blame Baylor's system either. RGIII was legitimately great his first year in the league, and Griffin vs. Luck looked like a fun rivalry for the next decade or so. But there's never been any player so good they could survive the Dan Snyder stink.

I hate Dan Snyder and think he's a disaster as an owner, but I don't think you can blame this on him.  The problem is that QBs who rely heavily on running generally don't do well in the NFL.  If they run a lot, they're great, but tend to get hurt pretty quickly.  And turning them into pocket passers rarely works well.  RGIII falls right into that pattern.  He ran a lot his first season, which worked great until he got hurt.  If they'd kept doing that, he would just have gotten hurt again and again.  So they tried to turn him into a pocket passer, and sure enough, it didn't work.

[washingtonismoney]

Did Dan Snyder like, order a hit? No. But his organization was definitely at fault. They didn't have to play RGIII while he was injured; they did. They didn't have to use that pasture they call a field; they still do.

There's a litany of stuff Snyder screwed up with respect to RGIII. Brushing it off as 'stuff happens' is silly.

[washingtonismoney]

Did Dan Snyder like, order a hit? No. But his organization was definitely at fault. They didn't have to play RGIII while he was injured; they did. They didn't have to use that pasture they call a field; they still do.

There's a litany of stuff Snyder screwed up with respect to RGIII. Brushing it off as 'stuff happens' is silly.

[Treebound]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career. 

RG3 will likely be traded soon as it sounds like he's lost his teammates as well.  I feel sorry for him, but as others have pointed out, the voters changed their tune between the Toby and then the Andrew runner-up years.  One of them should have won had the voters been consistent. 

I hope that McCaffrey is our next winner or dare I say, Hogan?!  After seeing Desmond Howard pick us to win, I'm getting optimistic...cautiously optimistic!

[Treebound]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career. 

RG3 will likely be traded soon as it sounds like he's lost his teammates as well.  I feel sorry for him, but as others have pointed out, the voters changed their tune between the Toby and then the Andrew runner-up years.  One of them should have won had the voters been consistent. 

I hope that McCaffrey is our next winner or dare I say, Hogan?!  After seeing Desmond Howard pick us to win, I'm getting optimistic...cautiously optimistic!

[FarmBoy]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career.

When was the last time Skip reiterated his pick of RGIII over Luck? He definitely sits shotgun on the "Luck is Overrated" and "Don't Install His Bust in Canton Yet" buses. But I haven't heard him state that he still believes RGIII was the better pick for a while. I could see him saying that it was just bad luck that derailed RGIII's career and that you can't take that into account when deciding who would have been the better pick and that the only real comparison was their rookie years when RGIII shone. While saying that injuries are bad luck, he ignores what all the pro-ALuck supporters were saying in 2012 that Luck was the better pick in the long run because of the lower likelihood of injury.

I'll give it to the media, though. They're not letting Skip forget his RGIII predictions: http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/skip-bayle...rly-wrong/

[FarmBoy]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career.

When was the last time Skip reiterated his pick of RGIII over Luck? He definitely sits shotgun on the "Luck is Overrated" and "Don't Install His Bust in Canton Yet" buses. But I haven't heard him state that he still believes RGIII was the better pick for a while. I could see him saying that it was just bad luck that derailed RGIII's career and that you can't take that into account when deciding who would have been the better pick and that the only real comparison was their rookie years when RGIII shone. While saying that injuries are bad luck, he ignores what all the pro-ALuck supporters were saying in 2012 that Luck was the better pick in the long run because of the lower likelihood of injury.

I'll give it to the media, though. They're not letting Skip forget his RGIII predictions: http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/skip-bayle...rly-wrong/

[Roberton3]

Did Dan Snyder like, order a hit? No. But his organization was definitely at fault. They didn't have to play RGIII while he was injured; they did. They didn't have to use that pasture they call a field; they still do.

There's a litany of stuff Snyder screwed up with respect to RGIII. Brushing it off as 'stuff happens' is silly.

I'm not defending Snyder here.  He and his organization did plenty of stuff wrong.  I'm just saying that even if the organization had done everything right, RGIII would still have been very unlikely to be a long-run success.

[Roberton3]

Did Dan Snyder like, order a hit? No. But his organization was definitely at fault. They didn't have to play RGIII while he was injured; they did. They didn't have to use that pasture they call a field; they still do.

There's a litany of stuff Snyder screwed up with respect to RGIII. Brushing it off as 'stuff happens' is silly.

I'm not defending Snyder here.  He and his organization did plenty of stuff wrong.  I'm just saying that even if the organization had done everything right, RGIII would still have been very unlikely to be a long-run success.

[washingtonismoney]

I'm not defending Snyder here.  He and his organization did plenty of stuff wrong.  I'm just saying that even if the organization had done everything right, RGIII would still have been very unlikely to be a long-run success.

Agree to disagree, I suppose.

[washingtonismoney]

I'm not defending Snyder here.  He and his organization did plenty of stuff wrong.  I'm just saying that even if the organization had done everything right, RGIII would still have been very unlikely to be a long-run success.

Agree to disagree, I suppose.

[BostonCard]

RGIII could have pulled an Elway and threatened not to sign if drafted by Washington and/or make them trade him.  Remember, Washington actually traded up to draft him.  He was probably athletic enough that he could have played another sport.  Moreover, if I recall, he had an interest in going to law school.

BC

[BostonCard]

RGIII could have pulled an Elway and threatened not to sign if drafted by Washington and/or make them trade him.  Remember, Washington actually traded up to draft him.  He was probably athletic enough that he could have played another sport.  Moreover, if I recall, he had an interest in going to law school.

BC

[Rally]

RGIII could have pulled an Elway and threatened not to sign if drafted by Washington and/or make them trade him.  Remember, Washington actually traded up to draft him.  He was probably athletic enough that he could have played another sport.  Moreover, if I recall, he had an interest in going to law school.

BC

Wasn't he already in law school his final year?

[Rally]

RGIII could have pulled an Elway and threatened not to sign if drafted by Washington and/or make them trade him.  Remember, Washington actually traded up to draft him.  He was probably athletic enough that he could have played another sport.  Moreover, if I recall, he had an interest in going to law school.

BC

Wasn't he already in law school his final year?

[Mick]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career.

When was the last time Skip reiterated his pick of RGIII over Luck? He definitely sits shotgun on the "Luck is Overrated" and "Don't Install His Bust in Canton Yet" buses. But I haven't heard him state that he still believes RGIII was the better pick for a while. I could see him saying that it was just bad luck that derailed RGIII's career and that you can't take that into account when deciding who would have been the better pick and that the only real comparison was their rookie years when RGIII shone. While saying that injuries are bad luck, he ignores what all the pro-ALuck supporters were saying in 2012 that Luck was the better pick in the long run because of the lower likelihood of injury.

I'll give it to the media, though. They're not letting Skip forget his RGIII predictions: http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/skip-bayle...rly-wrong/

Loud, obnoxious and incorrect is no way to go through life, son.

[Mick]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career.

When was the last time Skip reiterated his pick of RGIII over Luck? He definitely sits shotgun on the "Luck is Overrated" and "Don't Install His Bust in Canton Yet" buses. But I haven't heard him state that he still believes RGIII was the better pick for a while. I could see him saying that it was just bad luck that derailed RGIII's career and that you can't take that into account when deciding who would have been the better pick and that the only real comparison was their rookie years when RGIII shone. While saying that injuries are bad luck, he ignores what all the pro-ALuck supporters were saying in 2012 that Luck was the better pick in the long run because of the lower likelihood of injury.

I'll give it to the media, though. They're not letting Skip forget his RGIII predictions: http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/skip-bayle...rly-wrong/

Loud, obnoxious and incorrect is no way to go through life, son.

[BostonCard]

[quote author=Boston Card link=topic=12612.msg126213#msg126213 date=1441137770]
RGIII could have pulled an Elway and threatened not to sign if drafted by Washington and/or make them trade him.  Remember, Washington actually traded up to draft him.  He was probably athletic enough that he could have played another sport.  Moreover, if I recall, he had an interest in going to law school.

BC

Wasn't he already in law school his final year?
[/quote]

He was in a Master's program:

Griffin, who graduated with a Bachelor of Arts degree in political science with a 3.67 grade point average in December 2010, began pursuing a Master's in communications in 2011.[24][25] On January 11, 2012, Griffin officially announced his intention to enter the 2012 NFL Draft.[26]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Griffin_III

BC

[BostonCard]

[quote author=Boston Card link=topic=12612.msg126213#msg126213 date=1441137770]
RGIII could have pulled an Elway and threatened not to sign if drafted by Washington and/or make them trade him.  Remember, Washington actually traded up to draft him.  He was probably athletic enough that he could have played another sport.  Moreover, if I recall, he had an interest in going to law school.

BC

Wasn't he already in law school his final year?
[/quote]

He was in a Master's program:

Griffin, who graduated with a Bachelor of Arts degree in political science with a 3.67 grade point average in December 2010, began pursuing a Master's in communications in 2011.[24][25] On January 11, 2012, Griffin officially announced his intention to enter the 2012 NFL Draft.[26]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Griffin_III

BC

[JJJ]

[quote author=FarmBoy link=topic=12612.msg126175#msg126175 date=1441130384]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career.

When was the last time Skip reiterated his pick of RGIII over Luck? He definitely sits shotgun on the "Luck is Overrated" and "Don't Install His Bust in Canton Yet" buses. But I haven't heard him state that he still believes RGIII was the better pick for a while. I could see him saying that it was just bad luck that derailed RGIII's career and that you can't take that into account when deciding who would have been the better pick and that the only real comparison was their rookie years when RGIII shone. While saying that injuries are bad luck, he ignores what all the pro-ALuck supporters were saying in 2012 that Luck was the better pick in the long run because of the lower likelihood of injury.

I'll give it to the media, though. They're not letting Skip forget his RGIII predictions: http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/skip-bayle...rly-wrong/

Loud, obnoxious and incorrect is no way to go through life, son.
[/quote]

Appreciated the "Animal House" nod there.  8)

[JJJ]

[quote author=FarmBoy link=topic=12612.msg126175#msg126175 date=1441130384]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career.

When was the last time Skip reiterated his pick of RGIII over Luck? He definitely sits shotgun on the "Luck is Overrated" and "Don't Install His Bust in Canton Yet" buses. But I haven't heard him state that he still believes RGIII was the better pick for a while. I could see him saying that it was just bad luck that derailed RGIII's career and that you can't take that into account when deciding who would have been the better pick and that the only real comparison was their rookie years when RGIII shone. While saying that injuries are bad luck, he ignores what all the pro-ALuck supporters were saying in 2012 that Luck was the better pick in the long run because of the lower likelihood of injury.

I'll give it to the media, though. They're not letting Skip forget his RGIII predictions: http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/skip-bayle...rly-wrong/

Loud, obnoxious and incorrect is no way to go through life, son.
[/quote]

Appreciated the "Animal House" nod there.  8)

[Mick]

[quote author=Mick link=topic=12612.msg126235#msg126235 date=1441148336]
[quote author=FarmBoy link=topic=12612.msg126175#msg126175 date=1441130384]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career.

When was the last time Skip reiterated his pick of RGIII over Luck? He definitely sits shotgun on the "Luck is Overrated" and "Don't Install His Bust in Canton Yet" buses. But I haven't heard him state that he still believes RGIII was the better pick for a while. I could see him saying that it was just bad luck that derailed RGIII's career and that you can't take that into account when deciding who would have been the better pick and that the only real comparison was their rookie years when RGIII shone. While saying that injuries are bad luck, he ignores what all the pro-ALuck supporters were saying in 2012 that Luck was the better pick in the long run because of the lower likelihood of injury.

I'll give it to the media, though. They're not letting Skip forget his RGIII predictions: http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/skip-bayle...rly-wrong/

Loud, obnoxious and incorrect is no way to go through life, son.
[/quote]

Appreciated the "Animal House" nod there.  8)
[/quote]

Skip Bayless could be named "Flounder."

[Mick]

[quote author=Mick link=topic=12612.msg126235#msg126235 date=1441148336]
[quote author=FarmBoy link=topic=12612.msg126175#msg126175 date=1441130384]

Skip Bayless is an "idiot," Prince.  The guy continues to defend his comments regarding RG3 and Andrew.  At some point, you need to adjust your thinking and your commentary or any shred of credibility is lost.  Bayless is beyond that now and I have to believe at some point it impacts his career.

When was the last time Skip reiterated his pick of RGIII over Luck? He definitely sits shotgun on the "Luck is Overrated" and "Don't Install His Bust in Canton Yet" buses. But I haven't heard him state that he still believes RGIII was the better pick for a while. I could see him saying that it was just bad luck that derailed RGIII's career and that you can't take that into account when deciding who would have been the better pick and that the only real comparison was their rookie years when RGIII shone. While saying that injuries are bad luck, he ignores what all the pro-ALuck supporters were saying in 2012 that Luck was the better pick in the long run because of the lower likelihood of injury.

I'll give it to the media, though. They're not letting Skip forget his RGIII predictions: http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/skip-bayle...rly-wrong/

Loud, obnoxious and incorrect is no way to go through life, son.
[/quote]

Appreciated the "Animal House" nod there.  8)
[/quote]

Skip Bayless could be named "Flounder."

[Mick]

Flounder was hapless but good-hearted. I'd say the prevailing opinion on the board** would have Bayless as more of a Chip Diller type -- perhaps even a Doug Neidermeyer.

** I still remember Bayless as a talented young Los Angeles Times columnist when I was in college. And later, as editor of a political magazine, I had some very brief dealings with him in which he was always friendly. I don't watch or listen to sports-talk guys, because I find them all incredibly shallow and annoying, so I'm not familiar with his current incarnation.

Well, Bayless is a sxxt disturber.  I thnk of Bayless as more incompetent than anything else.  But he is a d-bag like Neidermayer. 

[Mick]

Flounder was hapless but good-hearted. I'd say the prevailing opinion on the board** would have Bayless as more of a Chip Diller type -- perhaps even a Doug Neidermeyer.

** I still remember Bayless as a talented young Los Angeles Times columnist when I was in college. And later, as editor of a political magazine, I had some very brief dealings with him in which he was always friendly. I don't watch or listen to sports-talk guys, because I find them all incredibly shallow and annoying, so I'm not familiar with his current incarnation.

Well, Bayless is a sxxt disturber.  I thnk of Bayless as more incompetent than anything else.  But he is a d-bag like Neidermayer. 

[BostonCard]

He's a troll.  Says stuff just to see if he can get a reaction.

BC

[BostonCard]

He's a troll.  Says stuff just to see if he can get a reaction.

BC

[fullmetal]

That's his job as a media figure in this day and age.  No such thing as bad publicity.

[fullmetal]

That's his job as a media figure in this day and age.  No such thing as bad publicity.