[washingtonismoney]

http://espn.go.com/blog/stanford-footbal...om-settled

Sign him up for guarded optimism? One thing you can always count on from Shaw is a non-direct but pretty clear assessment of where he thinks his players are at--recall his should've-been-infamous proclamation that "we think we'll be adequate" at WR back in the spring. (or something along those lines).

[washingtonismoney]

http://espn.go.com/blog/stanford-footbal...om-settled

Sign him up for guarded optimism? One thing you can always count on from Shaw is a non-direct but pretty clear assessment of where he thinks his players are at--recall his should've-been-infamous proclamation that "we think we'll be adequate" at WR back in the spring. (or something along those lines).

[JohnR34231]

If we are looking for the closest thing (physically, at least) to Andrew Luck.

Hogan is probably our guy.

[JohnR34231]

If we are looking for the closest thing (physically, at least) to Andrew Luck.

Hogan is probably our guy.

[Farm93]

It is hard to replace a 5-star recruit turned All-American.  I am sure the collection of 3-star and 4-star QB recruits are pretty strong and capable of starting at several programs.  To expect them to turn into Voldemort candidates (errr... 2 time Voldemort Runner-Up type athletes) is just unrealistic.  My bigger concern is with the talent at WR.  If the WR position improves then it will be OK.

Since Shaw was a WR I have some hope that Stanford can recruit and coach to a better place at that position to help offset the change at QB.

[Farm93]

It is hard to replace a 5-star recruit turned All-American.  I am sure the collection of 3-star and 4-star QB recruits are pretty strong and capable of starting at several programs.  To expect them to turn into Voldemort candidates (errr... 2 time Voldemort Runner-Up type athletes) is just unrealistic.  My bigger concern is with the talent at WR.  If the WR position improves then it will be OK.

Since Shaw was a WR I have some hope that Stanford can recruit and coach to a better place at that position to help offset the change at QB.

[SUIndian31]

It looks like one can read into his comments and see that he is entertaining the possibility of bringing on 5* Jameis Winston in this year's class. 

I think he is the top HS QB this year - better than Gunner Kiel.  From reading about him, he seems to be a good fit.

[SUIndian31]

It looks like one can read into his comments and see that he is entertaining the possibility of bringing on 5* Jameis Winston in this year's class. 

I think he is the top HS QB this year - better than Gunner Kiel.  From reading about him, he seems to be a good fit.

[OutsiderFan]

I agree re: WRs being key.

I would think the most important position to be paying attention to in terms of who can step up during bowl practices, is WR.  Is Devon Cajuste practicing?  Has any light gone on for JRP?  I've written off Roberts.

In 2012, you have Ty Montgomery and Drew Terrell, but after that?  I have no reason for feeling this way other than gut feel, but to me, Deante Gray and Connor Crane must step up big, fast if Stanford is to remain in the upper half of the North in 2012.  If Barry Sanders commits, he may be able to help out as a slot/3rd down RB, a la DeAnthony Thomas, but any way you slice it, Stanford is going to have to rely on YOUNG receivers.

[OutsiderFan]

I agree re: WRs being key.

I would think the most important position to be paying attention to in terms of who can step up during bowl practices, is WR.  Is Devon Cajuste practicing?  Has any light gone on for JRP?  I've written off Roberts.

In 2012, you have Ty Montgomery and Drew Terrell, but after that?  I have no reason for feeling this way other than gut feel, but to me, Deante Gray and Connor Crane must step up big, fast if Stanford is to remain in the upper half of the North in 2012.  If Barry Sanders commits, he may be able to help out as a slot/3rd down RB, a la DeAnthony Thomas, but any way you slice it, Stanford is going to have to rely on YOUNG receivers.

[washingtonismoney]

I agree re: WRs being key.

I would think the most important position to be paying attention to in terms of who can step up during bowl practices, is WR.  Is Devon Cajuste practicing?  Has any light gone on for JRP?  I've written off Roberts.

In 2012, you have Ty Montgomery and Drew Terrell, but after that?  I have no reason for feeling this way other than gut feel, but to me, Deante Gray and Connor Crane must step up big, fast if Stanford is to remain in the upper half of the North in 2012.  If Barry Sanders commits, he may be able to help out as a slot/3rd down RB, a la DeAnthony Thomas, but any way you slice it, Stanford is going to have to rely on YOUNG receivers.

Cajuste was injured before the year began, IIRC.

Anyway, I would guess Deante' Gray will be ready--at worst, we can just make him into Chris Owusu this year and throw him quick outs and bubble screens until viewers' eyes bleed.

[washingtonismoney]

I agree re: WRs being key.

I would think the most important position to be paying attention to in terms of who can step up during bowl practices, is WR.  Is Devon Cajuste practicing?  Has any light gone on for JRP?  I've written off Roberts.

In 2012, you have Ty Montgomery and Drew Terrell, but after that?  I have no reason for feeling this way other than gut feel, but to me, Deante Gray and Connor Crane must step up big, fast if Stanford is to remain in the upper half of the North in 2012.  If Barry Sanders commits, he may be able to help out as a slot/3rd down RB, a la DeAnthony Thomas, but any way you slice it, Stanford is going to have to rely on YOUNG receivers.

Cajuste was injured before the year began, IIRC.

Anyway, I would guess Deante' Gray will be ready--at worst, we can just make him into Chris Owusu this year and throw him quick outs and bubble screens until viewers' eyes bleed.

[washingtonismoney]

The Merc's version of the story: http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_19540374

[washingtonismoney]

The Merc's version of the story: http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_19540374

[Cardinal96]

It looks like one can read into his comments and see that he is entertaining the possibility of bringing on 5* Jameis Winston in this year's class. 

I think he is the top HS QB this year - better than Gunner Kiel.  From reading about him, he seems to be a good fit.

Winston is a soft FSU commit but has stated he still wants to visit Stanford and Auburn and likes the fact that we have solid academics along with a great baseball program (he is one of the nation's top baseball recruits).  He would be a great addition if we could get him.

[Cardinal96]

It looks like one can read into his comments and see that he is entertaining the possibility of bringing on 5* Jameis Winston in this year's class. 

I think he is the top HS QB this year - better than Gunner Kiel.  From reading about him, he seems to be a good fit.

Winston is a soft FSU commit but has stated he still wants to visit Stanford and Auburn and likes the fact that we have solid academics along with a great baseball program (he is one of the nation's top baseball recruits).  He would be a great addition if we could get him.

[slide]

a couple of notes.

if we lose DeCastro and Martin to the NFL, rebuilding the OL will be the top priority.  with poor OL play, it will be tough for any QB to succeed at Stanford.

Jameis ("Jaboo") Winston would be a great get for our programs.  we have had a lot of success with 2 sport athletes at Stanford and he would be welcomed in both.  4.0+ gpa, but no word on whether he has applied or not. 

on Picazo, I suspect with walk-ons when they earn scholarships the one year renewable is actually a one-year renewable (as opposed to scholarship guys who sign out of HS).

[slide]

a couple of notes.

if we lose DeCastro and Martin to the NFL, rebuilding the OL will be the top priority.  with poor OL play, it will be tough for any QB to succeed at Stanford.

Jameis ("Jaboo") Winston would be a great get for our programs.  we have had a lot of success with 2 sport athletes at Stanford and he would be welcomed in both.  4.0+ gpa, but no word on whether he has applied or not. 

on Picazo, I suspect with walk-ons when they earn scholarships the one year renewable is actually a one-year renewable (as opposed to scholarship guys who sign out of HS).

[JohnR34231]

Good for him; I think he's everyone's sentimental favorite.

Not sure he'll ever see the field much, but hopefully he'll get his chance, play like a million bucks, and prove me wrong.

[JohnR34231]

Good for him; I think he's everyone's sentimental favorite.

Not sure he'll ever see the field much, but hopefully he'll get his chance, play like a million bucks, and prove me wrong.

[yvonne]

if we lose DeCastro and Martin to the NFL, rebuilding the OL will be the top priority.  with poor OL play, it will be tough for any QB to succeed at Stanford.

I think "rebuilding" and "poor OL play" are overstating the case. Fleming and Yankey were honorable mention all conference as RS freshmen this year.

[yvonne]

if we lose DeCastro and Martin to the NFL, rebuilding the OL will be the top priority.  with poor OL play, it will be tough for any QB to succeed at Stanford.

I think "rebuilding" and "poor OL play" are overstating the case. Fleming and Yankey were honorable mention all conference as RS freshmen this year.

[OutsiderFan]

[quote author=slide link=topic=5168.msg37412#msg37412 date=1323879239]
if we lose DeCastro and Martin to the NFL, rebuilding the OL will be the top priority.  with poor OL play, it will be tough for any QB to succeed at Stanford.

I think "rebuilding" and "poor OL play" are overstating the case. Fleming and Yankey were honorable mention all conference as RS freshmen this year.
[/quote]

And they were both named Frosh AA by Rivals.  Even if Martin and DeCastro leave, Stanford brings back 3/5 of its starting OL from 2011 when you add Schwartzstein.  You've got Danser and Moran that have playing experience, the RS frosh Brendan Austin who was highly touted, and then potentially some elite True Frosh that could play right away, in addition to some more veteran guys that might be ready.  Stanford seems to be in fine shape on the OL.

I'm pretty confident Stanford will find a more than capable QB.  Again, it's the WRs that are the question mark.

[OutsiderFan]

[quote author=slide link=topic=5168.msg37412#msg37412 date=1323879239]
if we lose DeCastro and Martin to the NFL, rebuilding the OL will be the top priority.  with poor OL play, it will be tough for any QB to succeed at Stanford.

I think "rebuilding" and "poor OL play" are overstating the case. Fleming and Yankey were honorable mention all conference as RS freshmen this year.
[/quote]

And they were both named Frosh AA by Rivals.  Even if Martin and DeCastro leave, Stanford brings back 3/5 of its starting OL from 2011 when you add Schwartzstein.  You've got Danser and Moran that have playing experience, the RS frosh Brendan Austin who was highly touted, and then potentially some elite True Frosh that could play right away, in addition to some more veteran guys that might be ready.  Stanford seems to be in fine shape on the OL.

I'm pretty confident Stanford will find a more than capable QB.  Again, it's the WRs that are the question mark.

[terry]

The interesting footnote in that Merc story is that Robbie Picazo, midway through his junior year, is finally about to become a scholarship player.

I saw that. I was somewhat surprised at the report that Picazo's scholarship doesn't start until next quarter, because there was an announcement in August that Picazo, Ward, Fowler, and Parry, had earned scholarships "for this year."

<a href="http://www.gostanford.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/083011aaa.html">Link</a>

I wonder whether some part of this story got garbled somewhere.

[terry]

The interesting footnote in that Merc story is that Robbie Picazo, midway through his junior year, is finally about to become a scholarship player.

I saw that. I was somewhat surprised at the report that Picazo's scholarship doesn't start until next quarter, because there was an announcement in August that Picazo, Ward, Fowler, and Parry, had earned scholarships "for this year."

<a href="http://www.gostanford.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/083011aaa.html">Link</a>

I wonder whether some part of this story got garbled somewhere.

[slide]

not often do you have replace 2 All-American OL types at any college much less Stanford, then add 2 other OL losses -- Mabry and Bentler.  we return 3 guys with starting game experience -- Yankey, Fleming and Schwartzstein -- and 3 others with some game experience -- Danser (11), Underwood (5) and Wilkes (4).  that is not a lot of depth or experience on the OL. 

our '09 and '11 OL classes were Tyrone-like in their thin-ness (2 each year).  as a consequence, Shaw et al will go into '12 spring practice with 9 scholarship OL, plus 2 walk-ons OL -- Moran and McFadden.

on WRs, they have been a question mark for a couple of years.  receiving wise Fleener is our big loss.  who will/can replace him?

[slide]

not often do you have replace 2 All-American OL types at any college much less Stanford, then add 2 other OL losses -- Mabry and Bentler.  we return 3 guys with starting game experience -- Yankey, Fleming and Schwartzstein -- and 3 others with some game experience -- Danser (11), Underwood (5) and Wilkes (4).  that is not a lot of depth or experience on the OL. 

our '09 and '11 OL classes were Tyrone-like in their thin-ness (2 each year).  as a consequence, Shaw et al will go into '12 spring practice with 9 scholarship OL, plus 2 walk-ons OL -- Moran and McFadden.

on WRs, they have been a question mark for a couple of years.  receiving wise Fleener is our big loss.  who will/can replace him?

[terry]

Even if Martin and DeCastro leave, Stanford brings back 3/5 of its starting OL from 2011 when you add Schwartzstein.  You've got Danser and Moran that have playing experience, the RS frosh Brendan Austin who was highly touted, and then potentially some elite True Frosh that could play right away, in addition to some more veteran guys that might be ready.  Stanford seems to be in fine shape on the OL.

I agree that Stanford looks good at 3 of the 5 positions on the OL. Fleming and Yankey were very good this season, and Schwartzstein had a fine season as well. But beyond those three, we don't have any offensive linemen with substantial playing time. So we're going to have two new starters with little or no experience.

The candidates are:
Tackle -- Austin (redshirt freshman), Moran (redshirt freshman walk-on), or a true freshman
Guard -- Danser (redshirt junior), Wilkes (redshirt junior), Underwood (redshirt soph), Bonnell (redshirt soph), McFadden (redshirt soph walk-on), Reihner (redshirt freshman), or a true freshman

It's possible that Austin has the ability to step in as a starting tackle, but that's speculation at this point. I haven't heard anything about him, one way or another. If Austin isn't ready to start, then I assume Yankey will move to tackle, and we will be looking for two guards.

Danser has played some and was running with the first team at LG for most of fall camp. So I suppose he has the inside track at one guard position. Underwood got some playing time in the NotreDame game (at least I think the big guy wearing # 91 was Underwood), which is a somewhat promising sign. Beyond that, nobody has had any playing time, other than a few snaps by Wilkes in garbage time. I hope some of those guys can play.

If I had to guess, I'd say our starters could be: LT Yankey, LG Danser, C Schwartzstein, RG Underwood, RT Fleming. But that's just a guess, and it's not based on any practice observations or anything like that. I will be happy if one of the other young guys (Austin, Bonnell, Reihner) emerges as a legitimate starter.

[terry]

Even if Martin and DeCastro leave, Stanford brings back 3/5 of its starting OL from 2011 when you add Schwartzstein.  You've got Danser and Moran that have playing experience, the RS frosh Brendan Austin who was highly touted, and then potentially some elite True Frosh that could play right away, in addition to some more veteran guys that might be ready.  Stanford seems to be in fine shape on the OL.

I agree that Stanford looks good at 3 of the 5 positions on the OL. Fleming and Yankey were very good this season, and Schwartzstein had a fine season as well. But beyond those three, we don't have any offensive linemen with substantial playing time. So we're going to have two new starters with little or no experience.

The candidates are:
Tackle -- Austin (redshirt freshman), Moran (redshirt freshman walk-on), or a true freshman
Guard -- Danser (redshirt junior), Wilkes (redshirt junior), Underwood (redshirt soph), Bonnell (redshirt soph), McFadden (redshirt soph walk-on), Reihner (redshirt freshman), or a true freshman

It's possible that Austin has the ability to step in as a starting tackle, but that's speculation at this point. I haven't heard anything about him, one way or another. If Austin isn't ready to start, then I assume Yankey will move to tackle, and we will be looking for two guards.

Danser has played some and was running with the first team at LG for most of fall camp. So I suppose he has the inside track at one guard position. Underwood got some playing time in the NotreDame game (at least I think the big guy wearing # 91 was Underwood), which is a somewhat promising sign. Beyond that, nobody has had any playing time, other than a few snaps by Wilkes in garbage time. I hope some of those guys can play.

If I had to guess, I'd say our starters could be: LT Yankey, LG Danser, C Schwartzstein, RG Underwood, RT Fleming. But that's just a guess, and it's not based on any practice observations or anything like that. I will be happy if one of the other young guys (Austin, Bonnell, Reihner) emerges as a legitimate starter.

[Griffins78]

Plus our potential outstanding OL recruiting class.

[Griffins78]

Plus our potential outstanding OL recruiting class.

[terry]

Regarding that potential outstanding OL recruiting class, I'll believe it when I see it. Right now, based on current commitments, it's not an impressive class, especially considering that we really need to load up on offensive linemen.

In any event, I don't think it's a good idea to assume that a true freshman will start on the OL. It's really hard for a true freshman to start. Have we had a true freshman OL starter in the last 20 years? Or was Bob Whitfield the last one?

[terry]

Regarding that potential outstanding OL recruiting class, I'll believe it when I see it. Right now, based on current commitments, it's not an impressive class, especially considering that we really need to load up on offensive linemen.

In any event, I don't think it's a good idea to assume that a true freshman will start on the OL. It's really hard for a true freshman to start. Have we had a true freshman OL starter in the last 20 years? Or was Bob Whitfield the last one?

[unclechuck]

[quote author=SUIndian31 link=topic=5168.msg37381#msg37381 date=1323810120]
It looks like one can read into his comments and see that he is entertaining the possibility of bringing on 5* Jameis Winston in this year's class. 

I think he is the top HS QB this year - better than Gunner Kiel.  From reading about him, he seems to be a good fit.

Winston is a soft FSU commit but has stated he still wants to visit Stanford and Auburn and likes the fact that we have solid academics along with a great baseball program (he is one of the nation's top baseball recruits).  He would be a great addition if we could get him.
[/quote]

An encouraging side note Re Winston is that Gus Malzahn, Auburn's Broyles winning OC is leaving to take the AR-State head coach job. Will be interesting to see how former DC Chizak fares without him.

The timing is great for us, and the Shaw as Stanford lifer approach may be particularly compelling.

[unclechuck]

[quote author=SUIndian31 link=topic=5168.msg37381#msg37381 date=1323810120]
It looks like one can read into his comments and see that he is entertaining the possibility of bringing on 5* Jameis Winston in this year's class. 

I think he is the top HS QB this year - better than Gunner Kiel.  From reading about him, he seems to be a good fit.

Winston is a soft FSU commit but has stated he still wants to visit Stanford and Auburn and likes the fact that we have solid academics along with a great baseball program (he is one of the nation's top baseball recruits).  He would be a great addition if we could get him.
[/quote]

An encouraging side note Re Winston is that Gus Malzahn, Auburn's Broyles winning OC is leaving to take the AR-State head coach job. Will be interesting to see how former DC Chizak fares without him.

The timing is great for us, and the Shaw as Stanford lifer approach may be particularly compelling.

[yvonne]

In any event, I don't think it's a good idea to assume that a true freshman will start on the OL. It's really hard for a true freshman to start. Have we had a true freshman OL starter in the last 20 years? Or was Bob Whitfield the last one?

I agree that it's unlikely that a freshman OL would start. However, if depth is the issue, it's not unreasonable to think that one would play.

As for not having a stellar OL class, we have commitments fro two offensive linemen so far. Oregon has zero. Cal has two. USC had two, and is probably close to being finished. Washington has two, one of whom is a two-star center.

We're in the finals with six four- and five-star linemen. I sincerely doubt that we will either entirely whiff on evaluating or fail to sign fewer than two of those guys. Thus, we will most likely replenish the number of linemen we are losing. The quality may drop, but we're looking at a drop from All-America to All-Conference.

I would hardly characterize that as "poor."

[yvonne]

In any event, I don't think it's a good idea to assume that a true freshman will start on the OL. It's really hard for a true freshman to start. Have we had a true freshman OL starter in the last 20 years? Or was Bob Whitfield the last one?

I agree that it's unlikely that a freshman OL would start. However, if depth is the issue, it's not unreasonable to think that one would play.

As for not having a stellar OL class, we have commitments fro two offensive linemen so far. Oregon has zero. Cal has two. USC had two, and is probably close to being finished. Washington has two, one of whom is a two-star center.

We're in the finals with six four- and five-star linemen. I sincerely doubt that we will either entirely whiff on evaluating or fail to sign fewer than two of those guys. Thus, we will most likely replenish the number of linemen we are losing. The quality may drop, but we're looking at a drop from All-America to All-Conference.

I would hardly characterize that as "poor."

[76lsjumb]

For the past few Decembers, there have been at least three things that you could absolutely, completely, and without any doubt count on happening:  the winter solstice, reports of Jim Harbaugh leaving to take another job, and collective moaning, groaning, and gnashing of teeth regarding the likely performance of next season's offensive line.  Now, it's two things...

While I'm fully aware that complacency and overconfidence are insidious agents, it nevertheless seems to me that things have worked out reasonably well with the OL, even as we have lost, and had to replace, one All-Pac this or All-American that after another.  I'm confident the legacy of the Tunnel Workers' Union will live on, even as new members replace the old.  After all, unions seem to have a way of surviving...

[76lsjumb]

For the past few Decembers, there have been at least three things that you could absolutely, completely, and without any doubt count on happening:  the winter solstice, reports of Jim Harbaugh leaving to take another job, and collective moaning, groaning, and gnashing of teeth regarding the likely performance of next season's offensive line.  Now, it's two things...

While I'm fully aware that complacency and overconfidence are insidious agents, it nevertheless seems to me that things have worked out reasonably well with the OL, even as we have lost, and had to replace, one All-Pac this or All-American that after another.  I'm confident the legacy of the Tunnel Workers' Union will live on, even as new members replace the old.  After all, unions seem to have a way of surviving...