[KartyFan]

[quote author=norcard link=topic=14620.msg156909#msg156909 date=1456014651]
We're debating about a guy that has trouble breaking a 1500 out of 2400 out of multiple tries (essentially very basic math, writing, and vocabulary).  Think about that for a second.  Let's not inflate our academic standards here.

If Stanford does what most do that 1500 is on the 2 part test.
[/quote]

In that case, he's going to have a lot of trouble getting to CTCard's 1800+ ideal score!

[KartyFan]

[quote author=norcard link=topic=14620.msg156909#msg156909 date=1456014651]
We're debating about a guy that has trouble breaking a 1500 out of 2400 out of multiple tries (essentially very basic math, writing, and vocabulary).  Think about that for a second.  Let's not inflate our academic standards here.

If Stanford does what most do that 1500 is on the 2 part test.
[/quote]

In that case, he's going to have a lot of trouble getting to CTCard's 1800+ ideal score!

[norcard]

[quote author=norcard link=topic=14620.msg156909#msg156909 date=1456014651]
We're debating about a guy that has trouble breaking a 1500 out of 2400 out of multiple tries (essentially very basic math, writing, and vocabulary).  Think about that for a second.  Let's not inflate our academic standards here.

If Stanford does what most do that 1500 is on the 2 part test.
[/quote]

If that is a 1500 on math and verbal, he will be trying for a few more years.  It is definitely 3 part.

[norcard]

[quote author=norcard link=topic=14620.msg156909#msg156909 date=1456014651]
We're debating about a guy that has trouble breaking a 1500 out of 2400 out of multiple tries (essentially very basic math, writing, and vocabulary).  Think about that for a second.  Let's not inflate our academic standards here.

If Stanford does what most do that 1500 is on the 2 part test.
[/quote]

If that is a 1500 on math and verbal, he will be trying for a few more years.  It is definitely 3 part.

[winflop]

[quote author=SUBuddha link=topic=14620.msg156917#msg156917 date=1456021604]
[quote author=norcard link=topic=14620.msg156909#msg156909 date=1456014651]
We're debating about a guy that has trouble breaking a 1500 out of 2400 out of multiple tries (essentially very basic math, writing, and vocabulary).  Think about that for a second.  Let's not inflate our academic standards here.

If Stanford does what most do that 1500 is on the 2 part test.
[/quote]

If that is a 1500 on math and verbal, he will be trying for a few more years.  It is definitely 3 part.
[/quote]

If he had a 1500 on a 2-part SAT he would NOT be retaking.  Must be a 3-part, and I agree that 1500 is too low

[winflop]

[quote author=SUBuddha link=topic=14620.msg156917#msg156917 date=1456021604]
[quote author=norcard link=topic=14620.msg156909#msg156909 date=1456014651]
We're debating about a guy that has trouble breaking a 1500 out of 2400 out of multiple tries (essentially very basic math, writing, and vocabulary).  Think about that for a second.  Let's not inflate our academic standards here.

If Stanford does what most do that 1500 is on the 2 part test.
[/quote]

If that is a 1500 on math and verbal, he will be trying for a few more years.  It is definitely 3 part.
[/quote]

If he had a 1500 on a 2-part SAT he would NOT be retaking.  Must be a 3-part, and I agree that 1500 is too low

[TreesAndBirds]

1500 on the three part test is pretty much the national average of all test takers. So it seems like admissions is saying if he is in the botton half they wouldnt suggest even applying.

http://blog.prepscholar.com/what-is-a-go...-sat-score

[TreesAndBirds]

1500 on the three part test is pretty much the national average of all test takers. So it seems like admissions is saying if he is in the botton half they wouldnt suggest even applying.

http://blog.prepscholar.com/what-is-a-go...-sat-score

[Rally]

If I were Demetris and happened to read this entire thread I would not want to attend Stanford anymore.  From the posts, no one here knows him or his family personally.  No one knows for sure what was or was not said by admissions or any coaches.  No one knows for sure that 1500 is some sort of magic number.  Heck, no one seems certain whether that is 1500/1600 or 1500/2400.  But that doesn't stop us from speculating about his intellectual capacity, his attention to school work, or whether he flosses daily.  We sound like a 1950s era coffee latch of bored, middle-aged housewives.

Yes, some posts laud his determination, which is great.  Some others posit that he put in so much time on athletics he didn't have time to study.  Ok. 

[Rally]

If I were Demetris and happened to read this entire thread I would not want to attend Stanford anymore.  From the posts, no one here knows him or his family personally.  No one knows for sure what was or was not said by admissions or any coaches.  No one knows for sure that 1500 is some sort of magic number.  Heck, no one seems certain whether that is 1500/1600 or 1500/2400.  But that doesn't stop us from speculating about his intellectual capacity, his attention to school work, or whether he flosses daily.  We sound like a 1950s era coffee latch of bored, middle-aged housewives.

Yes, some posts laud his determination, which is great.  Some others posit that he put in so much time on athletics he didn't have time to study.  Ok. 

[Bosco]

Second that.

I could not imagine how much pressure he was going through these days.
Being a 5 * is an advantage also a big disadvantage, especially when you need to prepare for an exam which has been a big headache for everyone.
There is an article about Treyjhon Butler:

https://stanford.n.rivals.com/news/signe...ohn-butler

But the random messages you get at 2 a.m or 3 a.m. from coaches on the East Coast that are three hours ahead - I didn't appreciate those too much. I had to make sure my phone was turned off a lot. That was probably the roughest part.

We can have some idea of how much pressure Robertson is currently going through, given that he is the only 5 * player out there available and almost everyone is chasing him.
Not to mention all those "fans" from schools in his neighbor. Too many distractions and too many people want piece of him. And yes, we are all part of it.

Maybe we can all laugh off how "easy", how "basic",...etc those tests were after we all went through those processes many many years ago.
What I want to say is that they are just high school kids.
Many of them don't have any relative went to top tier universities such as Stanford, Princeton, Harvard,...,etc, who can provide lots of guidance, advises, experiences to help them out in this process.
They can only go through the process by themselves with so many other people want to get them to the directions they (I mean other people here) wanted.

I can still remember how nervous I was when preparing exams during my high school years. Honestly if I am in their shoes I am not sure if I can handle it at all.

[Bosco]

Second that.

I could not imagine how much pressure he was going through these days.
Being a 5 * is an advantage also a big disadvantage, especially when you need to prepare for an exam which has been a big headache for everyone.
There is an article about Treyjhon Butler:

https://stanford.n.rivals.com/news/signe...ohn-butler

But the random messages you get at 2 a.m or 3 a.m. from coaches on the East Coast that are three hours ahead - I didn't appreciate those too much. I had to make sure my phone was turned off a lot. That was probably the roughest part.

We can have some idea of how much pressure Robertson is currently going through, given that he is the only 5 * player out there available and almost everyone is chasing him.
Not to mention all those "fans" from schools in his neighbor. Too many distractions and too many people want piece of him. And yes, we are all part of it.

Maybe we can all laugh off how "easy", how "basic",...etc those tests were after we all went through those processes many many years ago.
What I want to say is that they are just high school kids.
Many of them don't have any relative went to top tier universities such as Stanford, Princeton, Harvard,...,etc, who can provide lots of guidance, advises, experiences to help them out in this process.
They can only go through the process by themselves with so many other people want to get them to the directions they (I mean other people here) wanted.

I can still remember how nervous I was when preparing exams during my high school years. Honestly if I am in their shoes I am not sure if I can handle it at all.

[FarmBoy]

If I were Demetris and happened to read this entire thread I would not want to attend Stanford anymore.

Not to excuse any neagtive posts about DR (I didn't notice any, but I haven't read every post in detail), but if recruits filtered out any school where some disparaging comments were made about them, very few recruits would ever sign. Didn't someone link a post to ND talking about DR with some pretty ugly stuff? And as alluded to, these kids have better/more important things to do than read all the crap said about them on the internet.

[FarmBoy]

If I were Demetris and happened to read this entire thread I would not want to attend Stanford anymore.

Not to excuse any neagtive posts about DR (I didn't notice any, but I haven't read every post in detail), but if recruits filtered out any school where some disparaging comments were made about them, very few recruits would ever sign. Didn't someone link a post to ND talking about DR with some pretty ugly stuff? And as alluded to, these kids have better/more important things to do than read all the crap said about them on the internet.

[Rally]

If I were Demetris and happened to read this entire thread I would not want to attend Stanford anymore.

Not to excuse any neagtive posts about DR (I didn't notice any, but I haven't read every post in detail), but if recruits filtered out any school where some disparaging comments were made about them, very few recruits would ever sign. Didn't someone link a post to ND talking about DR with some pretty ugly stuff? And as alluded to, these kids have better/more important things to do than read all the crap said about them on the internet.

I don't know, Farmboy, but I'm going to guess you are not in the same generation as Demetris, and have no idea how often and how much people of his generation monitor social media and mentions online about themselves.  Would you like your 17/18 year old self subjected to this much scrutiny by total strangers?  No.  As for other school sites, we keep talking about Stanford being a special place, so why justify this nonsense by comparing to other places?  I may be alone, but I say we give this kid a break and leave him alone.  What happens will happen and his, and our, life will go on.  If I were this kids father or uncle, and I read some of this stuff, I'd tell him, he'll, son, why do you want to go there?  Those people think they're better than you. 

Did you all sail through admissions?  All max the SAT?  Great, I guess, if so.  I didn't.

[Rally]

If I were Demetris and happened to read this entire thread I would not want to attend Stanford anymore.

Not to excuse any neagtive posts about DR (I didn't notice any, but I haven't read every post in detail), but if recruits filtered out any school where some disparaging comments were made about them, very few recruits would ever sign. Didn't someone link a post to ND talking about DR with some pretty ugly stuff? And as alluded to, these kids have better/more important things to do than read all the crap said about them on the internet.

I don't know, Farmboy, but I'm going to guess you are not in the same generation as Demetris, and have no idea how often and how much people of his generation monitor social media and mentions online about themselves.  Would you like your 17/18 year old self subjected to this much scrutiny by total strangers?  No.  As for other school sites, we keep talking about Stanford being a special place, so why justify this nonsense by comparing to other places?  I may be alone, but I say we give this kid a break and leave him alone.  What happens will happen and his, and our, life will go on.  If I were this kids father or uncle, and I read some of this stuff, I'd tell him, he'll, son, why do you want to go there?  Those people think they're better than you. 

Did you all sail through admissions?  All max the SAT?  Great, I guess, if so.  I didn't.

[rudruff]

As hard as it may be for some to believe, this is probably the tamest Demetris Robertson thread on the internet. Any other school that has been even considered by him has a lot more to say.

[rudruff]

As hard as it may be for some to believe, this is probably the tamest Demetris Robertson thread on the internet. Any other school that has been even considered by him has a lot more to say.

[ThePassionOfTheChryst]

I haven't read anything in this thread that would turn me off as a recruit, but then again I haven't read all 48 posts.  Maybe I missed something.

[ThePassionOfTheChryst]

I haven't read anything in this thread that would turn me off as a recruit, but then again I haven't read all 48 posts.  Maybe I missed something.

[Hulk01]

Hell hath no fury like a fan base scorned.

[Hulk01]

Hell hath no fury like a fan base scorned.

[Treebound]

Most of us here know that admissions at Stanford is not based on some formula.  The reality is that there is an overabundance of very qualified students and the admissions office does the best job it can to admit a solid class with great athletes, tuba players, debaters, etc...  We are now the most challenging university to gain admission to, with acceptance rates now below 5%.  Many here have children that were not admitted, and I have good friends that are still questioning why?    Admissions can't be a formula, but trends can be observed.

Regarding Robertson, I think it's great that he has set a high bar and is doing what he can to beat it.  He clearly wants to be admitted.  I'm guessing someone, likely on the coaching staff, gave him a range or number to try and achieve.  Maybe that gets him admitted, maybe not.  I'm pulling for the kid and appreciated his willingness to take the road less traveled.  It's the whole package that matters most, including the essays, recommendations and obviously his courses and grades.  I wish him luck and hope he makes it, but I think too many here are jumping to conclusions based on an admissions process that is not transparent...by design.

[Treebound]

Most of us here know that admissions at Stanford is not based on some formula.  The reality is that there is an overabundance of very qualified students and the admissions office does the best job it can to admit a solid class with great athletes, tuba players, debaters, etc...  We are now the most challenging university to gain admission to, with acceptance rates now below 5%.  Many here have children that were not admitted, and I have good friends that are still questioning why?    Admissions can't be a formula, but trends can be observed.

Regarding Robertson, I think it's great that he has set a high bar and is doing what he can to beat it.  He clearly wants to be admitted.  I'm guessing someone, likely on the coaching staff, gave him a range or number to try and achieve.  Maybe that gets him admitted, maybe not.  I'm pulling for the kid and appreciated his willingness to take the road less traveled.  It's the whole package that matters most, including the essays, recommendations and obviously his courses and grades.  I wish him luck and hope he makes it, but I think too many here are jumping to conclusions based on an admissions process that is not transparent...by design.

[FarmBoy]

ferrari - reread my post. I don't support any negative posts about recruits. I just posit that based on my experience, what any recruit would read hear is a lot more tame that what they'd read anywhere else. Put me firmly in the camp of those who think it's vile to publicly state that this or that recruit didn't get in based mostly on hearsay. If a recruit is interested in Stanford or has committed in any way (verbal or LOI), wonderful. If they change their mind or don't end up committing, there's no need for me as a fan to bother with whether it was their grades, scores or other reasons. But I would still contend that if a player is bothering to read fan boards as part of their decision making process, reading 99% of what's on the CardBoard would be rated far less negative than what's said on other boards.

[FarmBoy]

ferrari - reread my post. I don't support any negative posts about recruits. I just posit that based on my experience, what any recruit would read hear is a lot more tame that what they'd read anywhere else. Put me firmly in the camp of those who think it's vile to publicly state that this or that recruit didn't get in based mostly on hearsay. If a recruit is interested in Stanford or has committed in any way (verbal or LOI), wonderful. If they change their mind or don't end up committing, there's no need for me as a fan to bother with whether it was their grades, scores or other reasons. But I would still contend that if a player is bothering to read fan boards as part of their decision making process, reading 99% of what's on the CardBoard would be rated far less negative than what's said on other boards.

[OutsiderFan]

If someone challenges himself athletically and intellectually as much as Robertson does, and shows as much determination as he does, he's going to succeed at whatever it is he pursues in life.  If Stanford can't see this, some deeper questions probably should be asked about who is Stanford material and who isn't.

How perfectly absurd. Literally hundreds of millions of Americans succeed in life every year. Should they all get into Stanford?

Not everyone wants to get into Stanford.  People set all kinds of different objectives.  The ones who succeed in whatever endeavor it is they are pursuing, generally speaking, continue their effort until they meet their objective.  If Robertson doesn't get admitted this year, he could go to prep school and try again, right? 

[OutsiderFan]

If someone challenges himself athletically and intellectually as much as Robertson does, and shows as much determination as he does, he's going to succeed at whatever it is he pursues in life.  If Stanford can't see this, some deeper questions probably should be asked about who is Stanford material and who isn't.

How perfectly absurd. Literally hundreds of millions of Americans succeed in life every year. Should they all get into Stanford?

Not everyone wants to get into Stanford.  People set all kinds of different objectives.  The ones who succeed in whatever endeavor it is they are pursuing, generally speaking, continue their effort until they meet their objective.  If Robertson doesn't get admitted this year, he could go to prep school and try again, right? 

[donkey687]

How perfectly absurd. Literally hundreds of millions of Americans succeed in life every year. Should they all get into Stanford?

If the player is a 5 star likely NFL bound talent who can handle Stanford academically, the answer is YES, They should all get in!

[donkey687]

How perfectly absurd. Literally hundreds of millions of Americans succeed in life every year. Should they all get into Stanford?

If the player is a 5 star likely NFL bound talent who can handle Stanford academically, the answer is YES, They should all get in!

[TreesAndBirds]

i respect how forthcoming DR has been about his situation. Assuming what I read is accurate, admissions or someone told him the SAT score that would make it worthwhile for him to apply, and he has had the personal confidence to be upfront about it.

This has really helped shed some light on how admissions works. That basically they want football applicants to be in the top half of the country SAT wise, and then they will look at the person's other attributes...grades, extra curricular, etc in making a decision.

As admissions is understandably tight lipped on their thought process, I think this is an interesting although limited and imperfect insight. It is really much broader than DR.

In my mind he gets kudos for being so transparent, I hope it works out, if it doesnt he has nothing to be ashamed of, he seems like someone who will be very successful regardless. But I hope he gets in because our team and school will benefit, and I think he will benefit from being at Stanford.

[TreesAndBirds]

i respect how forthcoming DR has been about his situation. Assuming what I read is accurate, admissions or someone told him the SAT score that would make it worthwhile for him to apply, and he has had the personal confidence to be upfront about it.

This has really helped shed some light on how admissions works. That basically they want football applicants to be in the top half of the country SAT wise, and then they will look at the person's other attributes...grades, extra curricular, etc in making a decision.

As admissions is understandably tight lipped on their thought process, I think this is an interesting although limited and imperfect insight. It is really much broader than DR.

In my mind he gets kudos for being so transparent, I hope it works out, if it doesnt he has nothing to be ashamed of, he seems like someone who will be very successful regardless. But I hope he gets in because our team and school will benefit, and I think he will benefit from being at Stanford.

[Rally]

ferrari - reread my post. I don't support any negative posts about recruits. I just posit that based on my experience, what any recruit would read hear is a lot more tame that what they'd read anywhere else. Put me firmly in the camp of those who think it's vile to publicly state that this or that recruit didn't get in based mostly on hearsay. If a recruit is interested in Stanford or has committed in any way (verbal or LOI), wonderful. If they change their mind or don't end up committing, there's no need for me as a fan to bother with whether it was their grades, scores or other reasons. But I would still contend that if a player is bothering to read fan boards as part of their decision making process, reading 99% of what's on the CardBoard would be rated far less negative than what's said on other boards.

I didn't misread your post, and you are obviously on the right side of this, as are most.  I was responding, I artfully, to your comment that these kids don't have time to read this stuff.  All I meant was that they do have other things to do, I suspect they read everything that mentions their name. 

[Rally]

ferrari - reread my post. I don't support any negative posts about recruits. I just posit that based on my experience, what any recruit would read hear is a lot more tame that what they'd read anywhere else. Put me firmly in the camp of those who think it's vile to publicly state that this or that recruit didn't get in based mostly on hearsay. If a recruit is interested in Stanford or has committed in any way (verbal or LOI), wonderful. If they change their mind or don't end up committing, there's no need for me as a fan to bother with whether it was their grades, scores or other reasons. But I would still contend that if a player is bothering to read fan boards as part of their decision making process, reading 99% of what's on the CardBoard would be rated far less negative than what's said on other boards.

I didn't misread your post, and you are obviously on the right side of this, as are most.  I was responding, I artfully, to your comment that these kids don't have time to read this stuff.  All I meant was that they do have other things to do, I suspect they read everything that mentions their name. 

[Rally]

I have nothing against Demetris Robertson. Quite the contrary, anybody who wants badly to go to Stanford has my enthusiastic support, because I love Stanford and am inclined to love anybody else who feels likewise. And I certainly know nothing of his grades, test scores or anything else about his application.

I'm just opposed to what always seems to be the inevitable turn of threads like this: That anybody athlete who can survive at Stanford should be accepted. Which has now expanded to "any athlete who can succeed in life should be accepted." Stanford is not the Elks Club. It's a university, where academics count. Being a nice person who tries hard and usually muddles by is not enough.

Thank God you weren't around when I applied, Garvin :)

[Rally]

I have nothing against Demetris Robertson. Quite the contrary, anybody who wants badly to go to Stanford has my enthusiastic support, because I love Stanford and am inclined to love anybody else who feels likewise. And I certainly know nothing of his grades, test scores or anything else about his application.

I'm just opposed to what always seems to be the inevitable turn of threads like this: That anybody athlete who can survive at Stanford should be accepted. Which has now expanded to "any athlete who can succeed in life should be accepted." Stanford is not the Elks Club. It's a university, where academics count. Being a nice person who tries hard and usually muddles by is not enough.

Thank God you weren't around when I applied, Garvin :)

[jacketree]

How perfectly absurd. Literally hundreds of millions of Americans succeed in life every year. Should they all get into Stanford?

Good Lord no. Parking on campus would be impossible.

[jacketree]

How perfectly absurd. Literally hundreds of millions of Americans succeed in life every year. Should they all get into Stanford?

Good Lord no. Parking on campus would be impossible.

[JohnR34231]

If someone challenges himself athletically and intellectually as much as Robertson does, and shows as much determination as he does, he's going to succeed at whatever it is he pursues in life.  If Stanford can't see this, some deeper questions probably should be asked about who is Stanford material and who isn't.

How perfectly absurd. Literally hundreds of millions of Americans succeed in life every year. Should they all get into Stanford?

As long as they can all run sub 4.4 forties, they definitely should.

[JohnR34231]

If someone challenges himself athletically and intellectually as much as Robertson does, and shows as much determination as he does, he's going to succeed at whatever it is he pursues in life.  If Stanford can't see this, some deeper questions probably should be asked about who is Stanford material and who isn't.

How perfectly absurd. Literally hundreds of millions of Americans succeed in life every year. Should they all get into Stanford?

As long as they can all run sub 4.4 forties, they definitely should.