[stupac2]

stupac2, I think your response to my comment "Shaw is relentlessly risk-averse" is more a response to my semantics -- particularly my use of "relentlessly" --  than it is to the crux of my point. You cite one example of for it on 4th down during our first possession. I did not watch the 1st half of the Utah game and so was unaware we went for it on 4th down, but I still can't say I concede your counterpoint without knowing the circumstances. Going for it on 4th down on the 1st possession of the game is quite different than eschewing a makable FG for the win at the end of the game in which the defense had played brilliantly. I do, however, acknowledge that my use of "relentlessly" was a bit strong and perhaps an expression of my frustration/exasperation.

But I stand by my points. Shaw is extremely risk-averse and unwilling to take chances he does not deem almost absolutely necessary, and I could cite numerous examples. Off the top of my head, I can think of only one time Shaw took a risk that was not absolutely necessary. It was in the 2012 Oregon game when he had Hogan throw on 4th down to Hewitt. The play was unsuccessful, because Hogan short-armed the throw, but otherwise the play had worked perfectly. The Oregon defense was sold out to stop the predictable plunge into the middle of the line. The defense was completely fooled, and Hewitt was wide open and would have gained big yardage, and possibly scored, if Hogan had delivered the ball. Even though the play was unsuccessful, I applauded the call then and now.

And here's a curiosity: we ended up winning that game. I think by "playing not to lose," Shaw signals to his players that he does not fully trust them and does not believe they will make plays. And I think that becomes self-fulfilling. I think that is an important reason our guys don't make plays now like they used to. Harbaugh certainly had flaws and I don't think he was as good a representative of the university as Shaw is, but he had a unique ability (in my experience) to make his guys believe in themselves and then go out onto the field and actually make the plays that validated that belief. I think that is one of the biggest differences between Shaw and Harbaugh. Without some of that instinct to go for it and the inherent message that conveys to his players that Shaw believes in them and believes that they will make the plays he asks them to make, I fear that our best seasons are behind us and we will not be much fun to watch as well.

The thing is that you are just flat-out wrong. We did a similar 4th down conversion like the one against Utah against USC in 2012 (fake FB dive then pitch it out). You cited the one against Oregon that's another big one. So that's 3 big 4th down conversion attempts that come off the top of my head, against, what, a questionable punt and the ending of the Fiesta Bowl?

I get that this season is frustrating, but I really wish we'd restrict complaints to things that can actually be backed up with evidence and not meaningless confirmation bias.

[stupac2]

stupac2, I think your response to my comment "Shaw is relentlessly risk-averse" is more a response to my semantics -- particularly my use of "relentlessly" --  than it is to the crux of my point. You cite one example of for it on 4th down during our first possession. I did not watch the 1st half of the Utah game and so was unaware we went for it on 4th down, but I still can't say I concede your counterpoint without knowing the circumstances. Going for it on 4th down on the 1st possession of the game is quite different than eschewing a makable FG for the win at the end of the game in which the defense had played brilliantly. I do, however, acknowledge that my use of "relentlessly" was a bit strong and perhaps an expression of my frustration/exasperation.

But I stand by my points. Shaw is extremely risk-averse and unwilling to take chances he does not deem almost absolutely necessary, and I could cite numerous examples. Off the top of my head, I can think of only one time Shaw took a risk that was not absolutely necessary. It was in the 2012 Oregon game when he had Hogan throw on 4th down to Hewitt. The play was unsuccessful, because Hogan short-armed the throw, but otherwise the play had worked perfectly. The Oregon defense was sold out to stop the predictable plunge into the middle of the line. The defense was completely fooled, and Hewitt was wide open and would have gained big yardage, and possibly scored, if Hogan had delivered the ball. Even though the play was unsuccessful, I applauded the call then and now.

And here's a curiosity: we ended up winning that game. I think by "playing not to lose," Shaw signals to his players that he does not fully trust them and does not believe they will make plays. And I think that becomes self-fulfilling. I think that is an important reason our guys don't make plays now like they used to. Harbaugh certainly had flaws and I don't think he was as good a representative of the university as Shaw is, but he had a unique ability (in my experience) to make his guys believe in themselves and then go out onto the field and actually make the plays that validated that belief. I think that is one of the biggest differences between Shaw and Harbaugh. Without some of that instinct to go for it and the inherent message that conveys to his players that Shaw believes in them and believes that they will make the plays he asks them to make, I fear that our best seasons are behind us and we will not be much fun to watch as well.

The thing is that you are just flat-out wrong. We did a similar 4th down conversion like the one against Utah against USC in 2012 (fake FB dive then pitch it out). You cited the one against Oregon that's another big one. So that's 3 big 4th down conversion attempts that come off the top of my head, against, what, a questionable punt and the ending of the Fiesta Bowl?

I get that this season is frustrating, but I really wish we'd restrict complaints to things that can actually be backed up with evidence and not meaningless confirmation bias.