06-16-2025, 01:20 PM
(06-16-2025, 11:35 AM)BostonCard Wrote: One comment on Ukraine becoming like Israel is that Ukraine doesn't totally need to become like Israel in that it won't need to do large scale bombing campaigns over enemy airspace 1000 miles away. It's a much heavier lift to establish air superiority over an enemy airspace than it is over your own airspace. I presume Ukraine is not going to try to disarm Russia's nuclear capability.Unfortunately, in the NATO way of war, air supremacy over your own air space isn't near "good enough". Israel clearly has that, yet ballistic missiles are falling on its territory and killing its citizens. Israel is in the process of killing the archer. To do so requires entering Iranian airspace and persisting long enough to find and kill all the TELs Iran has. Alternatively, if that wasn't possible, Israel would inflict enough damage on Iran that Iran has no choice but to end the war. That is the "ideal" case.
BC
Ukraine ideally would need an air force that can inflict enough damage upon Russia that Russia could no longer fight. That is probably not attainable in anyone's wildest dreams. Having air supremacy over your own territory will not by itself stop a ground attack. The attacker (Russia) can bring up logistics at leisure in that case. Russia can also launch glide bombs with impunity, as they are at present. Ukraine would still have to fight a battle of attrition on the ground, which it very probably cannot win (unless Russia simply gives up).
If Ukraine can obtain air supremacy over a significant part (say 100/150 miles deep) of the Russian side of the FEBA, Ukraine can cut off the assembling Russian spearhead and kill it from the air. Ukraine needs to have (and retain indefinitely) the air power to do this mission. That wouldn't by itself defeat Russia, but it would make it absolutely clear to Russia that they couldn't defeat Ukraine either. Ideally, Ukraine would then advance into Russian held territory, easily mop up the Russians, rinse and repeat. This would eventually leading to a Russian collapse (or a Russian Tactical Nuclear Weapon. YMMV). NATO planned to do just that, but Ukraine will never have the resources to do it. They would quite quickly become over-extended and run out of bodies.
If neither Russia nor Ukraine can make any headway in this asymmetric struggle, both Ukraine and Russia could then bang away at each other with drones and tactical ballistic missiles. Ukraine would need to have parity there as well. This requires IMO an air capability not too dissimilar to what Israel possess today PLUS many more tactical ballistic missiles. Israel doesn't have enough Jerichos to go "head to head" with Iran in that exchange. Ukraine would need the ability to do that with Russia. So it ain't easy for Ukraine to be an Israel. It needs "reliable" allies. Of course Israel definitely needs a reliable US as an ally. That is often ignored. Ukraine wouldn't have that.
