[dabigv13]

http://www.si.com/college-football/2014/...head-coach

I keep coming across references like in the article above, that Harbaugh was really close, even wanted, to go to Michigan in 2011. That's certainly not how I remember it, but am I misremembering?

I think Michigan fans have a lot to be happy about today. But they all seem to be rewriting history to convince themselves that they will be a destination for Harbaugh. It's possible I suppose, but I doubt it. We heard all the same things ourselves.

[dabigv13]

http://www.si.com/college-football/2014/...head-coach

I keep coming across references like in the article above, that Harbaugh was really close, even wanted, to go to Michigan in 2011. That's certainly not how I remember it, but am I misremembering?

I think Michigan fans have a lot to be happy about today. But they all seem to be rewriting history to convince themselves that they will be a destination for Harbaugh. It's possible I suppose, but I doubt it. We heard all the same things ourselves.

[BostonCard]

Within hours of his hiring, the first article has come out speculating on his longevity

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id...r-how-long

Harbaugh is returning to college from the NFL ranks just as Pete Carroll, Nick Saban, Bobby Petrino, Steve Spurrier and others once did. But there’s one key difference here. Unlike those guys, who mostly failed at the next level before running back to campus, Harbaugh remains in high demand in the pro ranks. He's a proven winner there. So NFL teams will surely come calling again in the future. In fact, Michigan fans might have to prepare for near-annual Harbaugh-to-the-NFL rumors, and eventually some pro team with a highly favorable situation could lure him away.

I actually hope he stays in college for a while.  I really do think that he is a better fit for coaching in college than in the pros... if hew stays long enough.

BC

[BostonCard]

Within hours of his hiring, the first article has come out speculating on his longevity

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id...r-how-long

Harbaugh is returning to college from the NFL ranks just as Pete Carroll, Nick Saban, Bobby Petrino, Steve Spurrier and others once did. But there’s one key difference here. Unlike those guys, who mostly failed at the next level before running back to campus, Harbaugh remains in high demand in the pro ranks. He's a proven winner there. So NFL teams will surely come calling again in the future. In fact, Michigan fans might have to prepare for near-annual Harbaugh-to-the-NFL rumors, and eventually some pro team with a highly favorable situation could lure him away.

I actually hope he stays in college for a while.  I really do think that he is a better fit for coaching in college than in the pros... if hew stays long enough.

BC

[CTcard]

I actually hope he stays in college for a while.  I really do think that he is a better fit for coaching in college than in the pros... if hew stays long enough.

Given his actual record, it's certainly doesn't seem he's a bad fit for the pros.

It would seem that the biggest question of fit for Harbaugh is which bosses can put up with him for the longest.

[CTcard]

I actually hope he stays in college for a while.  I really do think that he is a better fit for coaching in college than in the pros... if hew stays long enough.

Given his actual record, it's certainly doesn't seem he's a bad fit for the pros.

It would seem that the biggest question of fit for Harbaugh is which bosses can put up with him for the longest.

[dabigv13]

Amen. Harbaugh is probably my favorite football coach to be a fan of, but I really hope his time in college is short. In no way can it be a positive for Stanford. He succeeded here at Stanford with smart and good football players and while I'm sure he will enjoy the looser admissions requirements, he's still going to want smart and good football players. We may not face off against Michigan too often for recruits now, but if there's a 5 star guy with the grades to make it here, Harbaugh will be all over that. And that's one of the few recruiting battles I think we could lose on a regular basis.

I don't think he'll be at Michigan for more than 4 or 5 years before he's back in the NFL. His competitive streak is too strong to not want to win a Super Bowl, and he's not an autocrat like Saban who fundamentally needs to control everything.

[dabigv13]

Amen. Harbaugh is probably my favorite football coach to be a fan of, but I really hope his time in college is short. In no way can it be a positive for Stanford. He succeeded here at Stanford with smart and good football players and while I'm sure he will enjoy the looser admissions requirements, he's still going to want smart and good football players. We may not face off against Michigan too often for recruits now, but if there's a 5 star guy with the grades to make it here, Harbaugh will be all over that. And that's one of the few recruiting battles I think we could lose on a regular basis.

I don't think he'll be at Michigan for more than 4 or 5 years before he's back in the NFL. His competitive streak is too strong to not want to win a Super Bowl, and he's not an autocrat like Saban who fundamentally needs to control everything.

[CTcard]

... he's still going to want smart and good football players.

Why so?

He succeeded at the 49ers with not-particularly-smart and good football players.

I think the common denominator is good football players.

[CTcard]

... he's still going to want smart and good football players.

Why so?

He succeeded at the 49ers with not-particularly-smart and good football players.

I think the common denominator is good football players.

[jacketree]

...and he's not an autocrat like Saban who fundamentally needs to control everything.

Interesting. There was a report on the radio this morning that he essentially has control over everything at Michigan.

Neutral for Stanford. If program success is based on having craptastic coaches at every potential competitor, that program isn't going to be very successful.  A rising tide lifts all boats. Or destroys them.

[jacketree]

...and he's not an autocrat like Saban who fundamentally needs to control everything.

Interesting. There was a report on the radio this morning that he essentially has control over everything at Michigan.

Neutral for Stanford. If program success is based on having craptastic coaches at every potential competitor, that program isn't going to be very successful.  A rising tide lifts all boats. Or destroys them.

[dabigv13]

Sure, it's college, that's what college coaches pretty much do. And I'm sure he'd rather have more control over things than less. But I don't think Harbaugh is a "college coach" in the sense that being the local monarch is what fulfills him professionally.

CT- you don't think Harbaugh would want guys like Andrus Peat or Kyle Murphy and that they in turn won't be intrigued by what he's offering? Michigan is a very good school and Harbaugh will sell that angle if it's going to get him good players. As a former Michigan player who has expressed his frustration at what it used to be like, and as a former Stanford head coach talking about excellence in everything, I think he will be a very formidable recruiting force swimming in the very little pond we swim in.

[dabigv13]

Sure, it's college, that's what college coaches pretty much do. And I'm sure he'd rather have more control over things than less. But I don't think Harbaugh is a "college coach" in the sense that being the local monarch is what fulfills him professionally.

CT- you don't think Harbaugh would want guys like Andrus Peat or Kyle Murphy and that they in turn won't be intrigued by what he's offering? Michigan is a very good school and Harbaugh will sell that angle if it's going to get him good players. As a former Michigan player who has expressed his frustration at what it used to be like, and as a former Stanford head coach talking about excellence in everything, I think he will be a very formidable recruiting force swimming in the very little pond we swim in.

[FarmBoy]

On why he went to college, rather than the NFL, I was wondering if it had to do with his contract with the 49ers:
* In order to play for an NFL team, would he have had to submit to a trade and therefore go into a pro situation where the team was potentially bad to start and losing draft picks and/or players to acquire him?
* Was there an out clause in the contract for specific jobs, such as Michigan?

I agree with those who hope to see him move on to the pros in short order. He can't help but hurt Stanford, even if on the margins. But I don't see him jumping after just 2-3 years. I think he'll want to build a legacy at Michigan before moving on.

[FarmBoy]

On why he went to college, rather than the NFL, I was wondering if it had to do with his contract with the 49ers:
* In order to play for an NFL team, would he have had to submit to a trade and therefore go into a pro situation where the team was potentially bad to start and losing draft picks and/or players to acquire him?
* Was there an out clause in the contract for specific jobs, such as Michigan?

I agree with those who hope to see him move on to the pros in short order. He can't help but hurt Stanford, even if on the margins. But I don't see him jumping after just 2-3 years. I think he'll want to build a legacy at Michigan before moving on.

[Hank 91]

My concern now is that he might look to the Stanford coaching staff (Lance Anderson, Shannon Turley) to fill his own staff at Michigan. I don't mind seeing assistant coaches move on to head coaching gigs or coordinator positions in the NFL, but a lateral move to Michigan would send a bad message.

[Hank 91]

My concern now is that he might look to the Stanford coaching staff (Lance Anderson, Shannon Turley) to fill his own staff at Michigan. I don't mind seeing assistant coaches move on to head coaching gigs or coordinator positions in the NFL, but a lateral move to Michigan would send a bad message.

[Spiny_Norman]

Harbaugh's first task will be hiring a staff.  He certainly might go after someone like Shannon Turley or Lance Anderson who worked for him previously.  I hope he goes after Tim Drevno who is the line coach at USC.  In his first year Drevno turned a question mark into a team strength.  Would love to see Drevno leave the Trojan staff (as long as he does not go to another opponent).

Note - Hank, I posted this as you were publishing your message.  I agree 100%.

[Spiny_Norman]

Harbaugh's first task will be hiring a staff.  He certainly might go after someone like Shannon Turley or Lance Anderson who worked for him previously.  I hope he goes after Tim Drevno who is the line coach at USC.  In his first year Drevno turned a question mark into a team strength.  Would love to see Drevno leave the Trojan staff (as long as he does not go to another opponent).

Note - Hank, I posted this as you were publishing your message.  I agree 100%.

[needle]

Being a former Stanford coach gives Harbaugh some credibility with academically-minded athletes. You can bet he's going to use that whenever he thinks it'll give him a recruiting advantage.

"Son, I've heard you're interested in a business/engineering/medical career after football. Let me tell you--and I spent time at Stanford, so trust me-- Michigan's business/engineering/medical academics bows to no program."

[needle]

Being a former Stanford coach gives Harbaugh some credibility with academically-minded athletes. You can bet he's going to use that whenever he thinks it'll give him a recruiting advantage.

"Son, I've heard you're interested in a business/engineering/medical career after football. Let me tell you--and I spent time at Stanford, so trust me-- Michigan's business/engineering/medical academics bows to no program."

[Bruce Wang]

It would seem that the biggest question of fit for Harbaugh is which bosses can put up with him for the longest.

Given how long the Skunkbears have been lost in the wildnerness, if Khaki Man wins they will put up with stuff that would sink Edwin Edwards.

[Bruce Wang]

It would seem that the biggest question of fit for Harbaugh is which bosses can put up with him for the longest.

Given how long the Skunkbears have been lost in the wildnerness, if Khaki Man wins they will put up with stuff that would sink Edwin Edwards.

[jacketree]

Pretty sure Stanford went to 4 consecutive BCS bowls while USC was signing 5 star recruits.  Maybe a bad quarter against Oregon from winning a national championship.  What ever happened to bowing to no program?  Be the team that wins. That also  means you don't worry when some midwestern school you never play gets a good coach.  I see very little impact to Stanford.  I don't really care, but it would be fun to see Harbaugh stay at Michigan long enough to throw down with Urban Meyer, Mark Dantonio, James Franklin, and, and.... (see how boring the Big Integer became with Bo Pelini out of the way? Jim is their new Bo.*) on a regular basis, eventually punching out some player from Clemson in a low level bowl to end his career.  Or more likely return Michigan to the cusp of winning it all, without winning it all, and move on.  Basically repeat his last three stops.  (Can't figure out why the 11-1 USD Pioneers weren't in the FCS playoffs in 2005 - maybe they were transitional?)

And in this era of schedule strength and conference reputation, you want to be in a strong conference rather than be the king of the weaklings.

*Probably could have held a drinking contest to the number of times Harbaugh mentioned Schembechler in his presser.

[jacketree]

Pretty sure Stanford went to 4 consecutive BCS bowls while USC was signing 5 star recruits.  Maybe a bad quarter against Oregon from winning a national championship.  What ever happened to bowing to no program?  Be the team that wins. That also  means you don't worry when some midwestern school you never play gets a good coach.  I see very little impact to Stanford.  I don't really care, but it would be fun to see Harbaugh stay at Michigan long enough to throw down with Urban Meyer, Mark Dantonio, James Franklin, and, and.... (see how boring the Big Integer became with Bo Pelini out of the way? Jim is their new Bo.*) on a regular basis, eventually punching out some player from Clemson in a low level bowl to end his career.  Or more likely return Michigan to the cusp of winning it all, without winning it all, and move on.  Basically repeat his last three stops.  (Can't figure out why the 11-1 USD Pioneers weren't in the FCS playoffs in 2005 - maybe they were transitional?)

And in this era of schedule strength and conference reputation, you want to be in a strong conference rather than be the king of the weaklings.

*Probably could have held a drinking contest to the number of times Harbaugh mentioned Schembechler in his presser.

[dabigv13]

That's true, but for the most part USC was signing 5 star guys that we weren't recruiting. Michigan, as a good school (though the football program is not YET known as an academically strong one in the way we are, or Northwestern/Vandy/ND *shudders* are), with Harbaugh as a former Stanford coach, presents a very different animal.

Granted, this will probably only affect us for a few guys a year. But those will be high profile guys. How different is Stanford football if the next Andrew Luck decides to go to Michigan for their top notch academics, football program, and coach.

[dabigv13]

That's true, but for the most part USC was signing 5 star guys that we weren't recruiting. Michigan, as a good school (though the football program is not YET known as an academically strong one in the way we are, or Northwestern/Vandy/ND *shudders* are), with Harbaugh as a former Stanford coach, presents a very different animal.

Granted, this will probably only affect us for a few guys a year. But those will be high profile guys. How different is Stanford football if the next Andrew Luck decides to go to Michigan for their top notch academics, football program, and coach.

[BostonCard]

Michigan is going to compete with, and occasionally take recruits from, Notre Dame much more often than it beats us for recruits (and even when that happens, they are midwest recruits, who we have always struggled to bring out here).  On net, I think a rising Michigan hurts one of our top rivals more than they hurt us.  And if we should ever meet Michigan in a Rose Bowl or a playoff game, then, I hope we beat the ever living crap out of Harbaugh, and go for two when we are up 48-21.

BC

[BostonCard]

Michigan is going to compete with, and occasionally take recruits from, Notre Dame much more often than it beats us for recruits (and even when that happens, they are midwest recruits, who we have always struggled to bring out here).  On net, I think a rising Michigan hurts one of our top rivals more than they hurt us.  And if we should ever meet Michigan in a Rose Bowl or a playoff game, then, I hope we beat the ever living crap out of Harbaugh, and go for two when we are up 48-21.

BC

[fullmetal]

I dunno if Harbaugh deserves the 2pt treatment, but I do wish he had stayed in the NFL.

[fullmetal]

I dunno if Harbaugh deserves the 2pt treatment, but I do wish he had stayed in the NFL.

[CTcard]

And in this era of schedule strength and conference reputation, you want to be in a strong conference rather than be the king of the weaklings.

It is not at all clear to me that we are in such an era - particularly the conference reputation part. Even if we were, Michigan is not in our conference. I di, however, agree his move to Michigan is mostly irrelevant to Stanford. 

CT- you don't think Harbaugh would want guys like Andrus Peat or Kyle Murphy

Of course he would, they are excellent football players. I don't think he would want them to sit down and discuss the philosophy of Kant or the implications of wave-particle duality. And, yes, of course if he and his program at Michigan would be intriguing; but I suppose we could always trot out his old quotations about the importance of academics at Michigan.

In general, for every top recruit there will be a tough competitor. One such competitor at a program we never play and rarely recruit successfully against is not the largest possible threat.

[CTcard]

And in this era of schedule strength and conference reputation, you want to be in a strong conference rather than be the king of the weaklings.

It is not at all clear to me that we are in such an era - particularly the conference reputation part. Even if we were, Michigan is not in our conference. I di, however, agree his move to Michigan is mostly irrelevant to Stanford. 

CT- you don't think Harbaugh would want guys like Andrus Peat or Kyle Murphy

Of course he would, they are excellent football players. I don't think he would want them to sit down and discuss the philosophy of Kant or the implications of wave-particle duality. And, yes, of course if he and his program at Michigan would be intriguing; but I suppose we could always trot out his old quotations about the importance of academics at Michigan.

In general, for every top recruit there will be a tough competitor. One such competitor at a program we never play and rarely recruit successfully against is not the largest possible threat.

[StanFan88]

Are you insane? I'm in favor of all talented college coaches except David Shaw going to the NFL, leaving our potential opponents in the hands of mediocrities. No good can come to Stanford of Jim Harbaugh coaching at Michigan.

Au contraire!  The best thing that can happen from this is less Ohio State overhype.

[StanFan88]

Are you insane? I'm in favor of all talented college coaches except David Shaw going to the NFL, leaving our potential opponents in the hands of mediocrities. No good can come to Stanford of Jim Harbaugh coaching at Michigan.

Au contraire!  The best thing that can happen from this is less Ohio State overhype.

[Mick]

[quote author=dabigv link=topic=11430.msg109260#msg109260 date=1419971521]
...and he's not an autocrat like Saban who fundamentally needs to control everything.

Interesting. There was a report on the radio this morning that he essentially has control over everything at Michigan.

Neutral for Stanford. If program success is based on having craptastic coaches at every potential competitor, that program isn't going to be very successful.  A rising tide lifts all boats. Or destroys them.
[/quote]


Late comment here, but I have two thoughts:

1)  First, Harbaugh's locker room reputation is both well-known among college HC's competing for the same talent AND the recruits, whereas I don't believe that was the case when he was at either USan Diego (not applicable) or Stanford (where the worst-to-first turnaround could overwhelm that story).  I don't think he'll be the recruiting juggernaut he was at Stanford despite Michigan's advantages.

2)  I think Harbaugh's assistant coaches really excelled with the smarter football players at Stanford.  He had ex-NFL coordinators running things, and their schemes overwhelmed the opponents.  Based on the staff I see him assembling at Michigan, I don't know that he will be able to replicate the talent of the coaches he had during his Stanford career.

3)  Let's say I'm dead wrong in public, and Harbaugh wins the national championship...or two.  Let's not forget that he's the fourth-winningest coach in modern NFL history.  The burn to win a Super Bowl probably doesn't go away.  I don't see him being Schembechler with a 21 year career there, although he will be the closest thing to a deity on earth in Michigan, based upon everyone I've spoken with there (I recently moved to Michigan).

[Mick]

[quote author=dabigv link=topic=11430.msg109260#msg109260 date=1419971521]
...and he's not an autocrat like Saban who fundamentally needs to control everything.

Interesting. There was a report on the radio this morning that he essentially has control over everything at Michigan.

Neutral for Stanford. If program success is based on having craptastic coaches at every potential competitor, that program isn't going to be very successful.  A rising tide lifts all boats. Or destroys them.
[/quote]


Late comment here, but I have two thoughts:

1)  First, Harbaugh's locker room reputation is both well-known among college HC's competing for the same talent AND the recruits, whereas I don't believe that was the case when he was at either USan Diego (not applicable) or Stanford (where the worst-to-first turnaround could overwhelm that story).  I don't think he'll be the recruiting juggernaut he was at Stanford despite Michigan's advantages.

2)  I think Harbaugh's assistant coaches really excelled with the smarter football players at Stanford.  He had ex-NFL coordinators running things, and their schemes overwhelmed the opponents.  Based on the staff I see him assembling at Michigan, I don't know that he will be able to replicate the talent of the coaches he had during his Stanford career.

3)  Let's say I'm dead wrong in public, and Harbaugh wins the national championship...or two.  Let's not forget that he's the fourth-winningest coach in modern NFL history.  The burn to win a Super Bowl probably doesn't go away.  I don't see him being Schembechler with a 21 year career there, although he will be the closest thing to a deity on earth in Michigan, based upon everyone I've spoken with there (I recently moved to Michigan).

[Treebound]

What surprises me is that Michigan alums were hating Harbaugh only 5-6 years ago when he told people/media how the "Michigan program/powers that be" talked him out of taking a more academically rigorous course load and focusing on easier majors while at Uof M.  He was very candid about this opinion and there was some vitriol that came into the media from former players and coaches.

This was all swept under the rug as he now returns in glory to "Raise the Maize!?"        I too, think he will head back to the NFL as soon as a befitting opening comes his way.  The Thanksgiving Dinner table conversation with his brother and his very competitive psyche will drive him to go after that SuperBowl ring.  I give him 3-4 years at most.  Besides, he loves the Bay Area and California - a few years in Ann Arbor will provide some strong motivation - isn't an arctic blast blowing in this week?! 

[Treebound]

What surprises me is that Michigan alums were hating Harbaugh only 5-6 years ago when he told people/media how the "Michigan program/powers that be" talked him out of taking a more academically rigorous course load and focusing on easier majors while at Uof M.  He was very candid about this opinion and there was some vitriol that came into the media from former players and coaches.

This was all swept under the rug as he now returns in glory to "Raise the Maize!?"        I too, think he will head back to the NFL as soon as a befitting opening comes his way.  The Thanksgiving Dinner table conversation with his brother and his very competitive psyche will drive him to go after that SuperBowl ring.  I give him 3-4 years at most.  Besides, he loves the Bay Area and California - a few years in Ann Arbor will provide some strong motivation - isn't an arctic blast blowing in this week?!