01-20-2022, 11:08 PM
Sadly, this game was over after 8 minutes.
Disappointing getting smoked at home.
Disappointing getting smoked at home.
MBB: Stanford vs Arizona, Thursday, 8 pm, ESPNU
01-20-2022, 11:21 PM
Stanford had zero players in double digits. Arizona had five. Just a brutal game all the way around. I think a loss was likely, but we were never in this.
BC
BC
Stanford had zero players in double digits. Arizona had five. Just a brutal game all the way around. I think a loss was likely, but we were never in this.
BC
BC
01-20-2022, 11:54 PM
Not sure what the future holds for this team but they MUST find time for Reynaud. He opens up the court for the other guys. Otherwise, not much to discuss except way too many turnovers, many unforced; open gate defense; and scaredy catness. Why was Taitz out?
Not sure what the future holds for this team but they MUST find time for Reynaud. He opens up the court for the other guys. Otherwise, not much to discuss except way too many turnovers, many unforced; open gate defense; and scaredy catness. Why was Taitz out?
01-21-2022, 04:27 AM
Two impressive wins, followed up by two unimpressive losses.
Anyone feel like they have seen this movie before in the Haase regime?
Anyone feel like they have seen this movie before in the Haase regime?
Two impressive wins, followed up by two unimpressive losses.
Anyone feel like they have seen this movie before in the Haase regime?
Anyone feel like they have seen this movie before in the Haase regime?
01-21-2022, 07:27 AM
The only thing I'd add on last night is that Arizona was extremely physical on defense and seemed to get away with a lot of stuff that would've been called fouls in most of our other games (especially all those games where every hand check was a foul...).
That said, we played terribly, deserved to lose, and would've lost regardless of what sort of officials we had.
I'm almost to the point of rooting for more losses to hasten Haase's departure. Every year the team's record is worse than the sum of our individual talent. He's just not a good coach, and I don't see evidence that he's improving year on year.
That said, we played terribly, deserved to lose, and would've lost regardless of what sort of officials we had.
I'm almost to the point of rooting for more losses to hasten Haase's departure. Every year the team's record is worse than the sum of our individual talent. He's just not a good coach, and I don't see evidence that he's improving year on year.
The only thing I'd add on last night is that Arizona was extremely physical on defense and seemed to get away with a lot of stuff that would've been called fouls in most of our other games (especially all those games where every hand check was a foul...).
That said, we played terribly, deserved to lose, and would've lost regardless of what sort of officials we had.
I'm almost to the point of rooting for more losses to hasten Haase's departure. Every year the team's record is worse than the sum of our individual talent. He's just not a good coach, and I don't see evidence that he's improving year on year.
That said, we played terribly, deserved to lose, and would've lost regardless of what sort of officials we had.
I'm almost to the point of rooting for more losses to hasten Haase's departure. Every year the team's record is worse than the sum of our individual talent. He's just not a good coach, and I don't see evidence that he's improving year on year.
01-21-2022, 07:41 AM
The small part I watched consisted of UA penetrating, Stanford flailing, and a pass for a layup or dunk. Stanford would then miss a long shot or make a TO. The most ridiculous possession was when Kisunas was left alone about 14 feet out and wouldn’t pass to anybody.
01-21-2022, 08:38 AM
Question ? Would the top 15 player of 2023 commit to a school and coach who didn’t have a contract for at least the player’s first year?
Arizona without two top players one for the game and the other for most was far superior. Stanford isn’t close to that level. Asu should be a better game
The play Phogge described was sad and comical
Arizona without two top players one for the game and the other for most was far superior. Stanford isn’t close to that level. Asu should be a better game
The play Phogge described was sad and comical
Question ? Would the top 15 player of 2023 commit to a school and coach who didn’t have a contract for at least the player’s first year?
Arizona without two top players one for the game and the other for most was far superior. Stanford isn’t close to that level. Asu should be a better game
The play Phogge described was sad and comical
Arizona without two top players one for the game and the other for most was far superior. Stanford isn’t close to that level. Asu should be a better game
The play Phogge described was sad and comical
01-21-2022, 08:47 AM
(This post was last modified: 01-21-2022, 08:47 AM by BostonCard.)
Yes, these transitions cause a hit to recruiting, but at some point you have to be willing to (rip the bandaid, bite the bullet, etc.); you can’t just make a coach a lifetime appointment just because recruiting will momentarily suffer.
what’s the point of attracting top-15 talent if you can’t use it to generate a top-68 team?
BC
what’s the point of attracting top-15 talent if you can’t use it to generate a top-68 team?
BC
(This post was last modified: 01-21-2022, 08:47 AM by BostonCard.)
Yes, these transitions cause a hit to recruiting, but at some point you have to be willing to (rip the bandaid, bite the bullet, etc.); you can’t just make a coach a lifetime appointment just because recruiting will momentarily suffer.
what’s the point of attracting top-15 talent if you can’t use it to generate a top-68 team?
BC
what’s the point of attracting top-15 talent if you can’t use it to generate a top-68 team?
BC
01-21-2022, 10:19 AM
David Shaw said that the team was only 4 plays from being right in the game.
Games vs. Arizona and UCLA are measuring stick games. Stanford has once again shown that they are not competitive with the best teams in the conference. Stanford looks like a middle of the Pac 12 team. They will finish 8-10, 9-9, somewhere around there.
Games vs. Arizona and UCLA are measuring stick games. Stanford has once again shown that they are not competitive with the best teams in the conference. Stanford looks like a middle of the Pac 12 team. They will finish 8-10, 9-9, somewhere around there.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
David Shaw said that the team was only 4 plays from being right in the game.
Games vs. Arizona and UCLA are measuring stick games. Stanford has once again shown that they are not competitive with the best teams in the conference. Stanford looks like a middle of the Pac 12 team. They will finish 8-10, 9-9, somewhere around there.
Games vs. Arizona and UCLA are measuring stick games. Stanford has once again shown that they are not competitive with the best teams in the conference. Stanford looks like a middle of the Pac 12 team. They will finish 8-10, 9-9, somewhere around there.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
01-21-2022, 10:59 AM
Ugh, so hard to watch. To me, the root of the problem is that Haase continues to mix it up too much with his personnel. Everyone can't be equal and interchangeable. It never comes together then and you end up with lineups that just don't make sense. Ingram needs the ball in his hands and needs to get 15+ shots a game (not 7) and a bunch of assists (not 1). Keefe and Kasunas are bench players, period. Not trying to be mean, but why is Keefe starting? Raynaud is a way better player offensively and he also rebounds. Delaire is playing like crap, but why? Well, if you are on the court with Keefe/Kasunas, you are playing 4 on 5. Delaire needs to play with guys who can shoot the ball and space the floor for him. Ugh, but instead we have to watch the turnstile of subs. It looks like 5th grade rec ball where everyone gets to play.
Ugh, so hard to watch. To me, the root of the problem is that Haase continues to mix it up too much with his personnel. Everyone can't be equal and interchangeable. It never comes together then and you end up with lineups that just don't make sense. Ingram needs the ball in his hands and needs to get 15+ shots a game (not 7) and a bunch of assists (not 1). Keefe and Kasunas are bench players, period. Not trying to be mean, but why is Keefe starting? Raynaud is a way better player offensively and he also rebounds. Delaire is playing like crap, but why? Well, if you are on the court with Keefe/Kasunas, you are playing 4 on 5. Delaire needs to play with guys who can shoot the ball and space the floor for him. Ugh, but instead we have to watch the turnstile of subs. It looks like 5th grade rec ball where everyone gets to play.
Stanford and UA may be in the same conference but Stanford is not even remotely in the same league as UA. A pathetic display of basketball by the Cardinal. Are there any players with serious athletic ability on Stanford's squad? Didn't look like it. Having Keefe out there makes it a 4 on 5 game on O. We have no athletic point guard; no rim protector; only Spencer Jones might make UA's team. No one in double figures? Are you kidding me? Haase, who seems like a good person, is not a good coach. Yet he'll probably get a contract extension from Muir. I used to be an ardent Stanford men's basketball fan and went to as many games as I could. Now, given the mediocre product on the floor, I've lost almost all interest.
Stanford and UA may be in the same conference but Stanford is not even remotely in the same league as UA. A pathetic display of basketball by the Cardinal. Are there any players with serious athletic ability on Stanford's squad? Didn't look like it. Having Keefe out there makes it a 4 on 5 game on O. We have no athletic point guard; no rim protector; only Spencer Jones might make UA's team. No one in double figures? Are you kidding me? Haase, who seems like a good person, is not a good coach. Yet he'll probably get a contract extension from Muir. I used to be an ardent Stanford men's basketball fan and went to as many games as I could. Now, given the mediocre product on the floor, I've lost almost all interest.
01-21-2022, 11:44 AM
(01-21-2022, 11:21 AM)MV72018 Wrote: Stanford and UA may be in the same conference but Stanford is not even remotely in the same league as UA. A pathetic display of basketball by the Cardinal. Are there any players with serious athletic ability on Stanford's squad? Didn't look like it. Having Keefe out there makes it a 4 on 5 game on O. We have no athletic point guard; no rim protector; only Spencer Jones might make UA's team. No one in double figures? Are you kidding me? Haase, who seems like a good person, is not a good coach. Yet he'll probably get a contract extension from Muir. I used to be an ardent Stanford men's basketball fan and went to as many games as I could. Now, given the mediocre product on the floor, I've lost almost all interest.
Look on the bright side, you weren't allowed to go to the home games for January, anyway . . .
The major sports programs at Stanford are a mess. Contrary to most in this thread, I have more faith in Haase than I do in Shaw; however, I have little faith in Haase right now.
AZ is a far superior team filled with International mercenaries (though I guess all athletes at all schools can be put in that bucket). I'm not sure I quite buy them as a legit FF team, but they are a LOT better than Stanford and most of the teams in the conference. This L was expected, though method of beat-down was not. It could not have helped that Maples was a cavernous morgue, though that certainly wasn't game-result changing.
(01-21-2022, 11:21 AM)MV72018 Wrote: Stanford and UA may be in the same conference but Stanford is not even remotely in the same league as UA. A pathetic display of basketball by the Cardinal. Are there any players with serious athletic ability on Stanford's squad? Didn't look like it. Having Keefe out there makes it a 4 on 5 game on O. We have no athletic point guard; no rim protector; only Spencer Jones might make UA's team. No one in double figures? Are you kidding me? Haase, who seems like a good person, is not a good coach. Yet he'll probably get a contract extension from Muir. I used to be an ardent Stanford men's basketball fan and went to as many games as I could. Now, given the mediocre product on the floor, I've lost almost all interest.
Look on the bright side, you weren't allowed to go to the home games for January, anyway . . .
The major sports programs at Stanford are a mess. Contrary to most in this thread, I have more faith in Haase than I do in Shaw; however, I have little faith in Haase right now.
AZ is a far superior team filled with International mercenaries (though I guess all athletes at all schools can be put in that bucket). I'm not sure I quite buy them as a legit FF team, but they are a LOT better than Stanford and most of the teams in the conference. This L was expected, though method of beat-down was not. It could not have helped that Maples was a cavernous morgue, though that certainly wasn't game-result changing.
01-21-2022, 01:11 PM
Not for nothing is Arizona ranked #3, but still...
Hasn't Reynaud been out for a while? I suspect he's not quite in 100% game shape yet. I am certain Haase knows that Reynaud needs more minutes once in shape, however.
Hasn't Reynaud been out for a while? I suspect he's not quite in 100% game shape yet. I am certain Haase knows that Reynaud needs more minutes once in shape, however.
01-21-2022, 01:17 PM
(01-21-2022, 10:59 AM)BillBradley Wrote: Ugh, so hard to watch. To me, the root of the problem is that Haase continues to mix it up too much with his personnel. Everyone can't be equal and interchangeable. It never comes together then and you end up with lineups that just don't make sense. Ingram needs the ball in his hands and needs to get 15+ shots a game (not 7) and a bunch of assists (not 1). Keefe and Kasunas are bench players, period. Not trying to be mean, but why is Keefe starting? Raynaud is a way better player offensively and he also rebounds. Delaire is playing like crap, but why? Well, if you are on the court with Keefe/Kasunas, you are playing 4 on 5. Delaire needs to play with guys who can shoot the ball and space the floor for him. Ugh, but instead we have to watch the turnstile of subs. It looks like 5th grade rec ball where everyone gets to play.
Couldn't agree more. 5th grade rec ball indeed. Nothing set up for Ingram or Jones; they shouldn't be limited to the same opportunities as Keefe and Kisunas. Delaire has regressed to dribbling in the paint to try to manufacture a shot. Awful, awful, awful.
(01-21-2022, 10:59 AM)BillBradley Wrote: Ugh, so hard to watch. To me, the root of the problem is that Haase continues to mix it up too much with his personnel. Everyone can't be equal and interchangeable. It never comes together then and you end up with lineups that just don't make sense. Ingram needs the ball in his hands and needs to get 15+ shots a game (not 7) and a bunch of assists (not 1). Keefe and Kasunas are bench players, period. Not trying to be mean, but why is Keefe starting? Raynaud is a way better player offensively and he also rebounds. Delaire is playing like crap, but why? Well, if you are on the court with Keefe/Kasunas, you are playing 4 on 5. Delaire needs to play with guys who can shoot the ball and space the floor for him. Ugh, but instead we have to watch the turnstile of subs. It looks like 5th grade rec ball where everyone gets to play.
Couldn't agree more. 5th grade rec ball indeed. Nothing set up for Ingram or Jones; they shouldn't be limited to the same opportunities as Keefe and Kisunas. Delaire has regressed to dribbling in the paint to try to manufacture a shot. Awful, awful, awful.
01-21-2022, 02:24 PM
While we're piling on Haase...we had 8 shots blocked last night. I checked the numbers, and Haase's teams have been in the bottom third of D-I in block % year after year. I don't think that Haase is coaching awareness of where defensive players are. Just because you are near the basket does not make it a good shot. Some pump fakes might help, but we hardly ever do that either.
While we're piling on Haase...we had 8 shots blocked last night. I checked the numbers, and Haase's teams have been in the bottom third of D-I in block % year after year. I don't think that Haase is coaching awareness of where defensive players are. Just because you are near the basket does not make it a good shot. Some pump fakes might help, but we hardly ever do that either.
01-21-2022, 02:53 PM
I still can't believe that Keefe and Kisunas didn't spend the offseason practicing 8-12 footers all day long. Really, at least throw the damn ball at the rim and hope for an OR (ironically we got 21 OR vs 33 DR for Arizona). A turnover or a handoff to someone with two seconds remaining on the shot clock is a lot worse than a heave-and-pray.
I still can't believe that Keefe and Kisunas didn't spend the offseason practicing 8-12 footers all day long. Really, at least throw the damn ball at the rim and hope for an OR (ironically we got 21 OR vs 33 DR for Arizona). A turnover or a handoff to someone with two seconds remaining on the shot clock is a lot worse than a heave-and-pray.
01-21-2022, 03:55 PM
(This post was last modified: 01-21-2022, 03:56 PM by AlbanyCardinal.)
Three generations of Stanford fans spent much of last night's game laughing (to stop from crying). It was the silent comedy of college basketball. The repeated blocks against Reynaud. Guys passing the ball back and forth to each other as if they were the only two on the team. Guys finding an opening for a mid-range jumper and not knowing what to do except stop and pass the ball to nowhere. Never seen it so bad. It'd be one thing if this team got destroyed by the likes of Baylor and AZ, but won the games they ought to win (Santa Clara, Udub). But no.
I was in Haase's camp after the explosive start to 2019-20, then had my doubts by season's end -- as much as Stanford spun it, it wasn't just a Covid lockdown that kept that squad out of the Big Dance. Last year was a bizarre season by any metric, so I had no problem giving him a mulligan. This season has to be make or break. No more excuses, no more "But he's such a good guy and recruiter." I'm not so delusional as to think a new coach would bring Stanford to the NCAAs any time soon, but this iteration of Stanford men's hoops needs to end.
As much as we complain about Muir, he was a hoops player in college, right? If he saw that game last night, he has to be disgusted. That's my hope, anyway.
I was in Haase's camp after the explosive start to 2019-20, then had my doubts by season's end -- as much as Stanford spun it, it wasn't just a Covid lockdown that kept that squad out of the Big Dance. Last year was a bizarre season by any metric, so I had no problem giving him a mulligan. This season has to be make or break. No more excuses, no more "But he's such a good guy and recruiter." I'm not so delusional as to think a new coach would bring Stanford to the NCAAs any time soon, but this iteration of Stanford men's hoops needs to end.
As much as we complain about Muir, he was a hoops player in college, right? If he saw that game last night, he has to be disgusted. That's my hope, anyway.
(This post was last modified: 01-21-2022, 03:56 PM by AlbanyCardinal.)
Three generations of Stanford fans spent much of last night's game laughing (to stop from crying). It was the silent comedy of college basketball. The repeated blocks against Reynaud. Guys passing the ball back and forth to each other as if they were the only two on the team. Guys finding an opening for a mid-range jumper and not knowing what to do except stop and pass the ball to nowhere. Never seen it so bad. It'd be one thing if this team got destroyed by the likes of Baylor and AZ, but won the games they ought to win (Santa Clara, Udub). But no.
I was in Haase's camp after the explosive start to 2019-20, then had my doubts by season's end -- as much as Stanford spun it, it wasn't just a Covid lockdown that kept that squad out of the Big Dance. Last year was a bizarre season by any metric, so I had no problem giving him a mulligan. This season has to be make or break. No more excuses, no more "But he's such a good guy and recruiter." I'm not so delusional as to think a new coach would bring Stanford to the NCAAs any time soon, but this iteration of Stanford men's hoops needs to end.
As much as we complain about Muir, he was a hoops player in college, right? If he saw that game last night, he has to be disgusted. That's my hope, anyway.
I was in Haase's camp after the explosive start to 2019-20, then had my doubts by season's end -- as much as Stanford spun it, it wasn't just a Covid lockdown that kept that squad out of the Big Dance. Last year was a bizarre season by any metric, so I had no problem giving him a mulligan. This season has to be make or break. No more excuses, no more "But he's such a good guy and recruiter." I'm not so delusional as to think a new coach would bring Stanford to the NCAAs any time soon, but this iteration of Stanford men's hoops needs to end.
As much as we complain about Muir, he was a hoops player in college, right? If he saw that game last night, he has to be disgusted. That's my hope, anyway.
(01-21-2022, 09:07 AM)winflop Wrote:(01-21-2022, 08:47 AM)BostonCard Wrote: what’s the point of attracting top-15 talent if you can’t use it to generate a top-68 team?
BC
THIS * 1 BAZILLION
The whole has always been less than the sum of the parts with Haase.
To be clear, this year's "parts" include exactly 3 players total ranked a composite 4* or better, two of whom are true freshmen.
I don't actually think the "parts" are as good as many others do. That's certainly not top-half-of-the-conference talent on paper.
(This post was last modified: 01-21-2022, 04:33 PM by SamuelMcF.)
(01-21-2022, 09:07 AM)winflop Wrote:(01-21-2022, 08:47 AM)BostonCard Wrote: what’s the point of attracting top-15 talent if you can’t use it to generate a top-68 team?
BC
THIS * 1 BAZILLION
The whole has always been less than the sum of the parts with Haase.
To be clear, this year's "parts" include exactly 3 players total ranked a composite 4* or better, two of whom are true freshmen.
I don't actually think the "parts" are as good as many others do. That's certainly not top-half-of-the-conference talent on paper.
(01-21-2022, 01:11 PM)fullmetal Wrote: Not for nothing is Arizona ranked #3, but still...
Hasn't Reynaud been out for a while? I suspect he's not quite in 100% game shape yet. I am certain Haase knows that Reynaud needs more minutes once in shape, however.
Raynaud missed 3 games (I think) due to health protocol; don't know how much he was able to practice.
(01-21-2022, 01:11 PM)fullmetal Wrote: Not for nothing is Arizona ranked #3, but still...
Hasn't Reynaud been out for a while? I suspect he's not quite in 100% game shape yet. I am certain Haase knows that Reynaud needs more minutes once in shape, however.
Raynaud missed 3 games (I think) due to health protocol; don't know how much he was able to practice.
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