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WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - 81alum - 12-14-2014

Overview:

It was Amber's turn to shine tonight, with 20 points, Kaylee had a monster 22 rebound game, and frosh Brittany McPhee showed her stuff nicely with 11 points and 4 rebounds.

Before the Game:

Tempe Tempie had a number of interesting observations before the game.  She noted that Kaylee is in there for one reason--to collect rebounds.  Chiney also focused on rebounds her freshman year.  Tempie said that you can't teach rebounding instincts, but you can teach everything else, and so there is every reason to believe that Kaylee will progress nicely in coming years.  All the frosh were adjusting to the pace of the college game and she hoped we would see more of Brittany if we got a lead--and we did and we did.

Reflecting on North Carolina she noted that we were never in sync.  Our offense just wasn't working properly.  Meanwhile, they had posts making three point shots.  She said Lili had been held out of the New Mexico game as a precaution with concussive symptoms.  She was fine for North Carolina but was pressing.  She had a lot of family and friends there from Hawaii and Tempie thought she was just trying too hard. 

Flow of the Game

Tara started McCall, Kaylee, Karlie, Lili and Amber.  Pretty much for the whole night we played a three guard lineup--mainly with Karlie in the 3 position.  Greenfield was held out of the game and when Bonnie came in, she was usually in the 4 position, so the wing spot was occupied by a guard the whole night.  Quite a change from years ago when we would have three bigs playing--I remember half a season when Ruef played the wing even.

Santa Clara played us tight for the first ten minutes of the game.  They have a terrific guard--Gilday--who was very hard to stop.  Lili guarded her but Gilday got herself open from screens mostly for mid range jumpers.  Meanwhile, they played tenacious man defense and held our shooting down in the first half.  Then we went on a 17-2 run to polish off the half and they never threatened again.  In the second half the lead built to 30 points and everyone got a chance to play, and our bench increased the lead. 

Performances

Amber of course, as our top scorer tonight, needs mentioning.  She was 7-12 for 20 points, and was our only reliable three point shooter tonight, going 2/3.  Three assists and three steals and 0 turnovers rounded out her excellent performance.

Kaylee is a rebounding vacuum.  In 27 minutes she collected 22 rebounds.  She also followed up a couple of O boards with baskets, but it is clear she has a way to go with her footwork before she can create offense like Chiney.  She did wind up with 9 points so she just missed a double-double.  Oh, and 2 nice blocks.

McPhee got 15 minutes, although it mostly came when the game was not in doubt.  On defense she looked lost once or twice, got burned by a speedy guard once,  but seemed to recover and was more confident as the game wore on.  She took it to the hoop and got fouled a couple of times, made a couple of baskets and a trey, and wound up with 11 points.  This was the first game where she seemed to get into the flow of the game and it is promising to see.

I am worried about Bird and Kailee.  Bird had 3 points and 2 rebounds in 16 minutes, Kailee had 1 point and 3 rebounds in 12 minutes.  When they got the ball under the basket they did not look good, McCall going 1-6 and Kailee 0-3.  Tempe had mentioned that after North Carolina a concerted effort was made to get the ball inside to McCall more.  Well, something was not working when she did get the ball.  The inside game is not where it should be heading off to Tennessee.

Bonnie played very well, scoring 11 points in 15 minutes.  Interestingly, only 3 of those were on a trey.  She went to the basket a few times and had a nice finger roll, and went 4/4 from the free throw line.  She is now 18/18 on free throws this season.

There were quite a few highlights from less common sources.  Bri Roberson is looking like the real deal.  She had 6 points on 3/4 shooting in 16 minutes of play.  While taller players can shoot over her, she is a tenacious defender and does not let anyone get by her unless she runs into a pick.  Alex Green played well and had a very pretty assist to go with a couple of baskets.

Looking Ahead:

Tara has seen what we can see--our bigs do not have much scoring prowess this year.  They are going to be needed for rebounding and defense and putbacks, but the hope that McCall would rapidly develop offensively  was overly optimistic.  On the other hand, the guards keep looking better and better, which is why Tara is playing three of them at a time.  I am still left wondering if this new offense will work against teams that are bigger and taller inside--like Texas and North Carolina.  We shall see, I guess, when we go to Tennessee.  First we have to get by Chattanooga, which beat Tennessee earlier this year.  Not exactly a "warm up", it seems.


Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - 81alum - 12-14-2014

Tara's take on the game:

Quote:Coming back after two weeks I thought our team played with a lot of energy," said VanDerveer, who is running a more up-tempo attack after years of the triangle offense. "Bonnie gave us a big lift in the first half. We had some different people helping us. ... We need more scoring and more production from our post game."
http://scores.espn.go.com/ncw/recap?gameId=400590419

And something interesting about Kaylee's 2 20+ rebound games:
Quote:Johnson's rebound total is tied for the third best in program history. Only Chiney Ogwumike, this year's No. 1 pick in the WNBA draft, had multiple 20-rebound performances with four, and Johnson now has two through her first eight college games.

I'm not sure quite what that reference means--does this mean third best in numbers of 20+ games?  I guess that means the Nneka never had more than one 20+ rebound game, and Kaylee already has two. 

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - mcortesi - 12-15-2014

See Stanford Individual Single-Game Records: http://www.gostanford.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=30600&ATCLID=209714402

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - M T - 12-15-2014

An enjoyable game, and a confidence booster.  Compared to the recent years, the whole team is playing at both ends of the court.

Quote:Bonnie played very well, scoring 11 points in 15 minutes.  Interestingly, only 3 of those were on a trey.  She went to the basket a few times and had a nice finger roll, and went 4/4 from the free throw line.  She is now 18/18 on free throws this season.

Bonnie is now 82/89 = 92% for her college career.  Stanford's career record is Kelly Suminski at 84%.  (So Bonnie is having half as many misses as Kelly.)  BUT, Bonnie won't make it onto Stanford's records as she doesn't shoot enough FTs (unless she gets another 118 this year!).  Too bad.... She has the most effortless free throw I can recall. 

And, she's not even in the NCAA rankings this year.  She'd need 20 attempts (2.5/game * 8 games).  If you gave her 2 misses to get to 20, she'd be tied for 5th.  It doesn't help her totals that she is only played less than 1/3 of each game.





Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - BobK - 12-15-2014

Thanks 81 excellent summary.    It's Tempie but what the heck. 😄

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - sheriand - 12-15-2014

Did anyone hear more details on why Taylor G. did not play? 

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - CompSci87 - 12-15-2014

(12-15-2014, 01:55 PM)wbbfan link Wrote:Did anyone hear more details on why Taylor G. did not play?

"Stanford played without forward Taylor Greenfield, who sat out with a left foot injury as a precaution. She is expected to return Wednesday at Chattanooga and then play at No. 11 Tennessee."

http://www.gostanford.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=30600&ATCLID=209808797

I noticed in warmups she was not suited up, but wasn't in a boot and was out passing the ball to the other players.


Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - BobK - 12-15-2014

On a boot last week.  Do we need her?

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - M T - 12-15-2014

I hadn't seen referee Marianne Karp previously this year, but I know she's got to know the rules better than to let a free throw air ball (by Johnson late in the first half) pass.  She was the official under the basket and I'd think it was her call.  From my point of view at the game, it was a clear air ball (that is, it did not hit the ring or flange as required by the rules).  From the broadcast camera angle, it was pretty clear too.  Santa Clara objected, and she responded to them, but of course I don't know what she said.  The only thing I can guess is that she couldn't tell it missed from her angle.  (I did confirm the rules haven't changed.  Hitting the net doesn't make it a legal foul shot.)

But then at 15:09 in the 2nd half, a Santa Clara player runs too far under the basket and has to release ("shoot") the ball behind the basket to avoid the travel call.  She then catches it herself, going L-R-L-R-L-R in her steps), with no one else being within 3 feet of the ball nor was the ball anywhere close to hitting the backboard.  I can't figure out why Karp (who was under the basket) didn't call that either.  She made no signal that the ball was tipped.



Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - FarmDad.01 - 12-15-2014

Are saying here that Marianne is the new Missy?

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - 81alum - 12-15-2014

(12-15-2014, 01:55 PM)wbbfan link Wrote:Did anyone hear more details on why Taylor G. did not play?
Tempie said before the game that it was precautionary and that she would have played if they had needed her.  But why use her when she wasn't needed?  Might as well rest it a bit more.  I think in part they wanted to make time for other players anyway, like McPhee, who they hoped to give some significant time to in a game they hoped to win handily.

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - 81alum - 12-15-2014

(12-15-2014, 07:07 AM)MT link Wrote:An enjoyable game, and a confidence booster.  Compared to the recent years, the whole team is playing at both ends of the court.

Quote:Bonnie played very well, scoring 11 points in 15 minutes.  Interestingly, only 3 of those were on a trey.  She went to the basket a few times and had a nice finger roll, and went 4/4 from the free throw line.  She is now 18/18 on free throws this season.

Bonnie is now 82/89 = 92% for her college career.  Stanford's career record is Kelly Suminski at 84%.  (So Bonnie is having half as many misses as Kelly.)  BUT, Bonnie won't make it onto Stanford's records as she doesn't shoot enough FTs (unless she gets another 118 this year!).  Too bad.... She has the most effortless free throw I can recall. 

And, she's not even in the NCAA rankings this year.  She'd need 20 attempts (2.5/game * 8 games).  If you gave her 2 misses to get to 20, she'd be tied for 5th.  It doesn't help her totals that she is only played less than 1/3 of each game.
Bonnie is getting quite a bit less time than her sister, and yet last night Bonnie was offensively one of the most productive players.  I really, really like the fact that she is moving to the basket and she is also pump faking defenders out of her way from the three point line and moving in for unopposed two point shots.  Her offensive game is becoming more complete.

I can only guess that Tara does not think Bonnie can defend well against certain types of players.  There was a moment towards the end of the game when Bonnie was in and I noticed her bodying up on a player who must have outweighed her by 50%.  I was almost afraid that Bonnie would break.  Or is it rebounding?  Bonnie has been averaging 13 minutes and less than one rebound.  But on defense Bonnie is not quick enough to guard most true guards nor big enough to guard big posts.  I have not watched closely, but perhaps Tara puts her in whenever she thinks there is someone on the other team that Bonnie can defend reasonably well.  Anyone else notice if there is rhyme or reason to when Bonnie gets to play? 

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - CompSci87 - 12-15-2014

Missy is known for flamboyantly delivered but weirdly wrong calls. These were just simple missed calls.

I googled a bit on those two rules, but didn't look enough to find an official rule book.

I see the rule is that if you air-ball a free throw (and you don' t have more free throws coming), the opposing team gets the ball out of bounds. I didn't know that rule before. So McPhee's nice play of saving the ball off an opponent shouldn't have been allowed.

On the non-call of traveling, perhaps the official deemed the play to be a legitimate shot attempt, though it hardly looked like one to me.

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - CompSci87 - 12-15-2014

(12-15-2014, 03:57 PM)81alum link Wrote:[quote author=MT link=topic=11340.msg108309#msg108309 date=1418652437]
An enjoyable game, and a confidence booster.  Compared to the recent years, the whole team is playing at both ends of the court.

Quote:Bonnie played very well, scoring 11 points in 15 minutes.  Interestingly, only 3 of those were on a trey.  She went to the basket a few times and had a nice finger roll, and went 4/4 from the free throw line.  She is now 18/18 on free throws this season.

Bonnie is now 82/89 = 92% for her college career.  Stanford's career record is Kelly Suminski at 84%.  (So Bonnie is having half as many misses as Kelly.)  BUT, Bonnie won't make it onto Stanford's records as she doesn't shoot enough FTs (unless she gets another 118 this year!).  Too bad.... She has the most effortless free throw I can recall. 

And, she's not even in the NCAA rankings this year.  She'd need 20 attempts (2.5/game * 8 games).  If you gave her 2 misses to get to 20, she'd be tied for 5th.  It doesn't help her totals that she is only played less than 1/3 of each game.
Bonnie is getting quite a bit less time than her sister, and yet last night Bonnie was offensively one of the most productive players.  I really, really like the fact that she is moving to the basket and she is also pump faking defenders out of her way from the three point line and moving in for unopposed two point shots.  Her offensive game is becoming more complete.

I can only guess that Tara does not think Bonnie can defend well against certain types of players.  There was a moment towards the end of the game when Bonnie was in and I noticed her bodying up on a player who must have outweighed her by 50%.  I was almost afraid that Bonnie would break.  Or is it rebounding?  Bonnie has been averaging 13 minutes and less than one rebound.  But on defense Bonnie is not quick enough to guard most true guards nor big enough to guard big posts.  I have not watched closely, but perhaps Tara puts her in whenever she thinks there is someone on the other team that Bonnie can defend reasonably well.  Anyone else notice if there is rhyme or reason to when Bonnie gets to play?
[/quote]

I understood that early in the season, Tara was limiting Bonnie's minutes because of her off-season surgery. Seeing how well she's been playing, I imagine her minutes will continue to increase.

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - BobK - 12-15-2014

Tara should be made to watch Bonnie play D against UConn.  >:(

Again why do we need Greenfield??

McPhee "saved" the ball by throwing it off a player who was already out of bounds.  Another bad call.

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - CompSci87 - 12-15-2014

(12-15-2014, 06:01 PM)BobK link Wrote:McPhee "saved" the ball by throwing it off a player who was already out of bounds.  Another bad call.

Doesn't that count?  I understand it was a bad call for a different reason (airballed free throw), but if a player steps out of bounds and touches the ball, it's out of bounds on that player, no?

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - BobK - 12-15-2014

Darn Tim.  I learn something new every day.  You are right and I owe several kids an apology.  Luckily they would be in their 30s by now.



Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - 81alum - 12-15-2014

(12-15-2014, 07:07 AM)MT link Wrote:An enjoyable game, and a confidence booster.  Compared to the recent years, the whole team is playing at both ends of the court.

Quote:Bonnie played very well, scoring 11 points in 15 minutes.  Interestingly, only 3 of those were on a trey.  She went to the basket a few times and had a nice finger roll, and went 4/4 from the free throw line.  She is now 18/18 on free throws this season.

Bonnie is now 82/89 = 92% for her college career.  Stanford's career record is Kelly Suminski at 84%.  (So Bonnie is having half as many misses as Kelly.)  BUT, Bonnie won't make it onto Stanford's records as she doesn't shoot enough FTs (unless she gets another 118 this year!).  Too bad.... She has the most effortless free throw I can recall. 

And, she's not even in the NCAA rankings this year.  She'd need 20 attempts (2.5/game * 8 games).  If you gave her 2 misses to get to 20, she'd be tied for 5th.  It doesn't help her totals that she is only played less than 1/3 of each game.
This is an argument to play her more and to have her go to the basket more.  With 92% free throw shooting she should be deadly as a mid range jumpshooter, too.

Bob, your reference to Bonnie's defense against Connecticut left me wondering--were you suggesting she played especially well on defense against UConn?  I went back and watched parts of the replay again and I saw Karlie playing exceptional defense on KML with Bonnie mostly playing back on Morgan Tuck.  It was odd--not a zone really but Bonnie often played way back.  I guess they were daring Tuck to shoot a jumper.  Tuck is 6'2" and was just 2/7, but was that Bonnie's doing?  I saw Tuck go around Bonnie for a couple of offensive rebounds. 

By the way, Tempie said that our defense against UConn was a "scheme" which I took to mean it was something specifically drawn up for that team that we probably won't see again.  Any idea what the scheme was?

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - BobK - 12-15-2014

In the Chalk Talk pre game they said Greenfield would guard M-Lewis, that didn't last long.  Often Bonnie was guarding Stewart.  Check the stats of Tuck and Stokes against Stanford and against ND.  Night and Day. 

Re: WBB: Stanford 82 Santa Clara 43 - CompSci87 - 12-15-2014

(12-15-2014, 09:02 PM)BobK link Wrote:Darn Tim.  I learn something new every day.  You are right and I owe several kids an apology.  Luckily they would be in their 30s by now.

I looked up the NCAA rule, and the wording is a bit confusing:

Quote:Out of Bounds and the Throw-in

Section 1. Out of Bounds—Player, Ball
...
Art. 2. The ball shall be out of bounds when it touches a player who is out of bounds, any other person, the floor or any object on or outside a boundary, the supports or back of the backboard, or the ceiling or overhead equipment.
...
Section 2. Ball Caused To Go Out of Bounds

Art. 1. The last player to touch the ball before the ball goes out of bounds caused the ball to go out of bounds, provided that the ball is out of bounds because it touched something other than a player who is out of bounds.

Art. 2. When the ball is out of bounds because of touching or being touched by a player who is on or outside a boundary, such player has caused the ball to go out of bounds.
http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/BR15.pdf

I found something in the NCAA casebook that clarifies a case I was unsure about:

Quote:A.R. 181. A throw-in by A1 strikes B1 who is inbounds, rebounds from B1 directly into the air, then strikes A1 who is still out of bounds.

RULING: A1 shall be considered to have caused the ball to go out of bounds. The ball shall be awarded to Team B at a designated spot nearest to where the violation occurred.
(Rule 7-2.1)
http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/WBKB13.pdf

I really thought I had seen this one called the other way, but I guess I was mistaken.