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59ers throw young QB to the wolves - washingtonismoney - 08-16-2013

Name true freshman (and Stanford offer aspirant) Jared Goff to the starting position. Interesting move. True freshmen QBs are typically quite bad*, so that and the tough schedule might not combine well.

*(I've also seen a study that suggests that true freshmen QBs progress more slowly than QBs that start at a later date, but I was a bit suspicious of the methodology.)

https://twitter.com/BFeldmanCBS/status/368410762542186498

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - JohnR34231 - 08-16-2013

I find this statement somewhat amusing given all the criticism of Harbaugh for not throwing Andrew Luck "to the wolves" as a true freshman.

Not saying this guy is another Andrew Luck, but.....

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - FarmBoy - 08-16-2013

Quote:(and Stanford offer aspirant)

Evidence? I thought he was a Ca'l guy through and through. Doesn't he have family connections?

What does previous golden boy Kline do? I assume he holds tight through this season, but if Goff holds onto the starting position, he transfers after this season. He has 4 years of eligibility, same as Goff.

If Goff doesn't suffer irreparable psychological damage, the prospect of a 3-4 year starter with an elite ceiling is a bit frightening.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - washingtonismoney - 08-16-2013

(08-16-2013, 10:19 AM)FarmBoy link Wrote:Evidence? I thought he was a Ca'l guy through and through. Doesn't he have family connections?

Visited us the same Junior Day Burns did. To be fair, yes, you can visit without being particularly interested, but I didn't feel like being fair, as it is C.al. Felt like a good troll.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - FarmBoy - 08-16-2013

I must admit. I thought it was an odd decision by Goff to commit to Ca'l, given that Kline was supposed to be elite and there already. I guess he decided any advantage in experience Kline gained was lost when Dykes brought in a new scheme.

Skipping his senior year seems to have paid off well.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - Mick - 08-16-2013

(08-16-2013, 10:19 AM)FarmBoy link Wrote:
Quote:(and Stanford offer aspirant)

What does previous golden boy Kline do? I assume he holds tight through this season, but if Goff holds onto the starting position, he transfers after this season. He has 4 years of eligibility, same as Goff.

If Goff doesn't suffer irreparable psychological damage, the prospect of a 3-4 year starter with an elite ceiling is a bit frightening.


I was on a road trip for business a few years ago, and working out in the hotel's spartan training room.  They had one elliptical and a weight set, nothing else.  Unaccountably, the elliptical machine had a television.  It only had a few channels, and one of them included Trent Dilfer's Elite 11 quarterbacks camp, with 18 of the nation's best HS QBs (Manziel was at his camp in 2011).  Dilfer's camp is exceptional, he noted in 2011 that 22 of the starting 32 NFL QBs had been through his camp.

Of the 24 HS QBs at his camp, every single one of them looked like a young Johnny Unitas, square jaw, crewcut, built like a truck, etc...except for one long-haired kid named Zach Kline.

The first day of the camp, Dilfer roasted Kline, basically said he was at or near the back of the pack for a variety of reasons.  The second weeek, Dilfer says Kline materially improved at an unprecedented level, and by the end he counted Kline among the leaders at his Elite 11 high school quarterback camp, ranking 6th out of the original 24: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1053846-washington-recruiting-where-did-the-elite-11-quarterbacks-sign

So if Kline has been benched by a true frosh, odds are the guy's pretty good.

Incidentally, several Bay Area QBs were at this year's Elite 11 camp, including Keller Chryst (Paly/Stanford) and KJ Carta Samuels (Bellarmine/Vanderbilt).  They're doing pretty well:

http://www.studentsports.com/blog/2013/06/30/elite-11-day-3-sun-am-updates/

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1669082-latest-news-and-updates-on-2013-elite-11-qb-competition

Both were originally named to the final 11 at the Elite 11 camp, they ended up ranked #6 and #7 in this ranking:
https://twitter.com/Elite11/status/351795124411441152

Ultimately, only Carta Samuels was named to the Elite 11.
https://twitter.com/RecruitingESPN/status/352635447194820608

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - washingtonismoney - 08-16-2013

Dy.kes has previously started a true freshman QB -- in 2011, a bloke named Nick Isham. Isham was bad, completing 60% of his passes for 5.7 YPA and 7 picks in a half-season's work.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - yvonne - 08-16-2013

How'd he do the following year?

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - washingtonismoney - 08-16-2013

(08-16-2013, 11:41 AM)Yvonne link Wrote:How'd he do the following year?

Isham transferred to Arizona and sat out 2012. He doesn't have a scholarship at Arizona, though apparently he's "making a pitch" to start (http://azstarnet.com/sports/football/college/wildcats/arizona-football-ex-la-tech-qb-makes-pitch/article_7bb37fb8-3a50-5642-9e3f-1cbdc2bbdb24.html)

It's like buying a new car... then finding out it's discontinued - Redrum - 08-16-2013

Kline was the apple of Tedford's eye.  Dykes wants something else in a QB to fit his hurry-up spread.  Maybe Goff has it and Dykes felt Kline didn't.  So Kline went all-in for Kal and now he knows his coach views him as a backup QB at best and will be working hard to recruit over him for the remainder of his time as a B.ear.

Sometimes life isn't fair.  I swear to God it isn't.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - 71Bear - 08-16-2013

Goff's dad played baseball at UC. 

I think Goff was slected as the starter because of his accuracy - he is more accurate on the short/intermediate routes than Kline.  Since D.ykes stated philosophy is to "move the chains", it is evident that he puts a premium on accuracy.

Also, Goff is not a true freshman in the traditional sense of the term because he enrolled in January and took part in spring ball.  Coming out of those sessions, he was one of three "equals" (with Kline and Hinder).

It will be interesting to see how he does.  If nothing else, D.ykes is being true to his mantra - "play the best guy" (something that JT did not always do towards the end of his tenure).




Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - terry - 08-16-2013

I did not know that incoming freshmen at UC Berkeley had the option of graduating from high school a semester early and enrolling at Berkeley in the spring term. How many incoming freshmen do that? And how do they get their admission decision early? My understanding was that Berkeley admission decisions are released in March.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - stupac2 - 08-16-2013

(08-16-2013, 07:34 PM)terry link Wrote:I did not know that incoming freshmen at UC Berkeley had the option of graduating from high school a semester early and enrolling at Berkeley in the spring term. How many incoming freshmen do that? And how do they get their admission decision early? My understanding was that Berkeley admission decisions are released in March.

Athletes often know early. A girl I know who went to Stanford for rowing knew she was accepted by the fall of her Senior year. I sort of doubt that rowers get more attention than football players.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - terry - 08-16-2013

(08-16-2013, 07:36 PM)stupac2 link Wrote:[quote author=terry link=topic=8239.msg65852#msg65852 date=1376706844]
I did not know that incoming freshmen at UC Berkeley had the option of graduating from high school a semester early and enrolling at Berkeley in the spring term. How many incoming freshmen do that? And how do they get their admission decision early? My understanding was that Berkeley admission decisions are released in March.

Athletes often know early. A girl I know who went to Stanford for rowing knew she was accepted by the fall of her Senior year. I sort of doubt that rowers get more attention than football players.
[/quote]

But nobody enrolls at Stanford in the middle of what would otherwise be their senior year in high school.

I'm trying to figure out how often incoming freshmen at Berkeley do that.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - stupac2 - 08-16-2013

(08-16-2013, 07:37 PM)terry link Wrote:But nobody enrolls at Stanford in the middle of what would otherwise be their senior year in high school.

I'm trying to figure out how often incoming freshmen at Berkeley do that.

Well, I answered one of your questions. I don't know anything about the others.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - Farm93 - 08-16-2013

(08-16-2013, 07:34 PM)terry link Wrote:I did not know that incoming freshmen at UC Berkeley had the option of graduating from high school a semester early and enrolling at Berkeley in the spring term. How many incoming freshmen do that? And how do they get their admission decision early? My understanding was that Berkeley admission decisions are released in March.
I was not a D1 athlete, but I seem to recall I knew well before March that I was accepted to UCB.  Though maybe that was just because I knew from the point formula that I would not be rejected.  In any event, the UCB website definitely notes that the March timing you recall is for fall term applicants.  The website clearly implies that applications for other terms is possible and that those decision dates will be different.

applicants for winter or spring should contact the campus admissions office regarding admission notification periods

Given the enormous challenges that exist for completing a UCB degree in four years, I could imagine that some non-athlete students would want to enroll early.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - pincemob - 08-16-2013

Enrolling in college early seems doable (don't some of our guys take summer school prior to the start of the year?  In years past I am pretty sure they did).  Graduating a full semester early from high school would seem like the harder part.  Do these guys take the GED or somehow rack up all their units early?  I think if I (as a non athlete) had the chance to graduate early from high school I would have done it.  I don't recall that being possible. 

As for Goff vs. Kline.. I have seen both play on TV.  I thought they were pretty equal.  Kline seems like more of an inspirational leader / gun-slinger type.  Sort of reminded me of Jake Plummer.  Goff seems steady and reserved, but also more robotic/mechanical.  Kline has to feel snubbed.  Recall he was in that same recruiting class which fell apart when Lupoi left, but he was outspokenly committed through all of that drama and stayed on.  Also, Kline's high school predecessor is starting at Boise State and he probably feels confident he can start high D1 level also.  My $ would be on him leaving.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - Farm93 - 08-16-2013

(08-16-2013, 08:33 PM)norcalcard link Wrote:In years past I am pretty sure they did).  Graduating a full semester early from high school would seem like the harder part.
My school had trimesters, they worked like Stanford quarters.  A student needed 12 trimesters of English, 11 of Social Studies, but 10 or less of everything else.  So, in theory, all one needed to do at my school was double up on English classes as a junior, and take one simple elective of Social studies along the way.  It was not that tough, but most high achievers in my school saw no real value in pressing to graduate early since the most selective universities wanted students to start in August/September.

Sadly, I can imagine some families might be inclined to have their kids start college ASAP, and eliminating the senioritis period would be one of many ways to get a little jump on the process.

The benefits of an early start to a football player seems obvious, and I can even imagine that some schools would offer the option to all students just to be able to get their football players in for spring sessions.

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - 71Bear - 08-16-2013

Answer to Terry's question: an average of 2-3 guys/year enroll in the Spring Semester prior to their "freshman year". 

I have no idea how the admissions process works so I can't answer his question re: how they are admitted.  If I had to guess, I would imagine they complete the required number of units/classes in 3 1/2 years of HS (not that hard to do considering the "extra credit" that is awarded for taking and passing AP classes/exams). 

Re: 59ers throw young QB to the wolves - terry - 08-17-2013

I'm sorry, my question wasn't clear.

I'm trying to find out whether regular UC Berkeley students -- non-athletes -- can graduate from high school a semester early and immediately enroll at UC Berkeley for spring semester. If they can do that, how do they get their admissions decisions, given that admissions decisions normally are made in March?

This document says "Berkeley does not accept applications for the spring semester." http://admissions.berkeley.edu/sites/default/files/docs/Freshman_Flier.pdf

Is that correct? Or is it possible for regular students to graduate early and enroll in the spring? Or is that option available only to football players?