Outside Topic Giants/Niners 2022 thread - Printable Version
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RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - lex24 - 01-22-2022
I keep hearing (deep voice): “The frozen tundra of Lambeau Field” in my head. Should I be worried…..:)
RE: lex24 - Mick - 01-22-2022
(01-18-2022, 08:15 AM)lex24 Wrote:(01-17-2022, 11:07 PM)Mick Wrote: Fun NFL facts:
1) Road teams were 1-5 in the NFL playoffs. Niners had the only win.
2) Aaron Rodgers is 0-3 against the 49ers in the playoffs.
3) Cowboys averaged 6 yards per play over the season, but 4.4 against the 49ers. Extrapolated over the season, that would be last in the NFL.
4) Cowboys were #1 in scoring offense at 31.3 in the NFL. Niner defense held them to just over half their season average.
5) Jimmy Ward said SF loaded up against the run to "dare" Prescott to beat them with his passing.
6) Niner OL didn't give up a sack.
7) Robbie Gould hasn't missed a FG in his playoff career. He's 18-18.
8) Remember that fake punt again Dallas? Niner special teams players should remember there's no pass interference on fake punts. Just for the future.
9) Niners finished 7th in the NFL in rushing (127.4) and got better as they went along. They averaged 138.8 rush ypg the last four regular season games and ran for 169 against the Cowboys.
10) 49ers ranked 5th in the NFL with 48 sacks in 2021.
11) 49ers were #3 in total defense.
12) Jimmy G. had a 98.7 passer rating this year, but a 102.9 in his last 10 regular season games.
13) Packers beat the 49ers 30-28 in game 3 of the regular season on a 51 yard walkoff field goal.
14) There will be a high of 21 degrees on Saturday. Game time is 5:15 local time.
No PI? Or no 5 yard rule? Can’t believe if they throws pass to a receiver and he’s tackled while ball is in air that it’s not PI.
Nonetheless, Norman didn’t play the gunner. He turned and headed back towards the returner. A major mental error. Niners should have kept their defense in and replaced a safety with Benjamin - on orders to fair catch.
The rule has to do with blocking, not tackling. Since the result of a punt is intended to be a fair catch or a return, the return team is expected to be either receiving the ball or blocking for the runner, and the kicking team is supposes to tackle and/or be blocked. The blocking expectation means that blocking contact is allowed on a fake, per NFL rules.
(01-18-2022, 10:21 AM)Phogge Wrote: Lance is not close. Smoke signals coming out of the Edward DeBartolo Senior Center in Santa Clara. But it doesn’t matter because Lex has already traded Jimmy and received Nick Mullins in return.
That's funny...in The Athletic, there's an article with players raving about Trey Lance's amazing success on the scout team.
(01-18-2022, 08:42 PM)lex24 Wrote: Niners grossly overpaid him based on a 5 game stretch of meaningless games. He was better before the knee injury. But I don’t know if he ever was a particularly accurate downfield passer. Great release. But not a downfield guy. Still, the contract is why he will be gone next year.
As for Shanahans offense, it’s run oriented with the pass game predicated on play action. Lance was in an offense at NDS that incorporated those elements. It’s folly to base much of anything on the tidbits we’ve seen so far. Rookie QBs are almost never successful. Learning NFL offenses and defenses take a while. Unless you are Andrew Luck. And savants don’t come around often.
Obviously Shanahan doesn’t want to have to throw him into the fray in a divisional playoff game. Probably wont have to. But thumb, plus shoulder isn’t good. What’s next - elbow?
FWLIW, Jimmy Garoppolo has the second highest road win percentage since the AFL/NFL merger (including playoffs) of any quarterback with 25 or more starts:
Patrick Mahomes, 26-7 (.788)
Jimmy Garoppolo, 20-6 (.769)
Joe Montana, 63-25 (.716)
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - Phogge - 01-22-2022
Scout team success? LOL. Dylan Paultz was supposed to be a great scout team QB. More LOL.
YA Tittle for Lou Cordileone. Les Richter for 11 guys, only two who played a snap in the NFL. Basically nobody for Bill White. The rights to Robert Parrish for Joe Barry Carroll. Basically firing George Seifert for Mariucci. Letting Ralphie Valladeres, the best jammer in roller derby history, slip away to the LA T Birds... yada, yada.
Lex, Mick, DC... what do you think they can get for Jimmy G so as not to add to the above list of all time bombs?
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - Giants - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 11:13 AM)Phogge Wrote: Scout team success? LOL. Dylan Paultz was supposed to be a great scout team QB. More LOL.
YA Tittle for Lou Cordileone. Les Richter for 11 guys, only two who played a snap in the NFL. Basically nobody for Bill White. The rights to Robert Parrish for Joe Barry Carroll. Basically firing George Seifert for Mariucci. Letting Ralphie Valladeres, the best jammer in roller derby history, slip away to the LA T Birds... yada, yada.
Lex, Mick, DC... what do you think they can get for Jimmy G so as not to add to the above list of all time bombs?
Whoa! Hang on. Sam Jones was a lot more than “Basically nobody”. Jones had a couple darn good years for the Giants, including a stellar 1959 season. You can list the infamous George Foster trade or Gaylord Perry for Sam McDowell as bombs but not White for Jones.
As for Jimmy G. - a draft choice will be the return on the deal.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - DC 86 - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 11:13 AM)Phogge Wrote: Lex, Mick, DC... what do you think they can get for Jimmy G so as not to add to the above list of all time bombs?
He only has one year left on his contract, very reasonable salary for a veteran of his caliber but not rookie contract level.
Meaning second-to-third round pick depending on what other return there is, and almost certainly with some clause that upgrades the pick based on Garopollo's (or the acquiring team's) performance and his health. In a vacuum he has a lot of value (compare him to Darnold, and what the Panthers gave up for him) but only one year left on his contract.
I could see a second round pick that becomes a first round pick if Garoppolo starts a minimum number of games (given his injury history) and the acquiring team reaches the playoffs, or a third round pick and additional compensation (player and/or lower pick/s) that can become a second round pick based on the same types of conditions (health, playoffs) as above.
lex24 - lex24 - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 10:59 AM)Mick Wrote:(01-18-2022, 08:15 AM)lex24 Wrote:(01-17-2022, 11:07 PM)Mick Wrote: Fun NFL facts:
1) Road teams were 1-5 in the NFL playoffs. Niners had the only win.
2) Aaron Rodgers is 0-3 against the 49ers in the playoffs.
3) Cowboys averaged 6 yards per play over the season, but 4.4 against the 49ers. Extrapolated over the season, that would be last in the NFL.
4) Cowboys were #1 in scoring offense at 31.3 in the NFL. Niner defense held them to just over half their season average.
5) Jimmy Ward said SF loaded up against the run to "dare" Prescott to beat them with his passing.
6) Niner OL didn't give up a sack.
7) Robbie Gould hasn't missed a FG in his playoff career. He's 18-18.
8) Remember that fake punt again Dallas? Niner special teams players should remember there's no pass interference on fake punts. Just for the future.
9) Niners finished 7th in the NFL in rushing (127.4) and got better as they went along. They averaged 138.8 rush ypg the last four regular season games and ran for 169 against the Cowboys.
10) 49ers ranked 5th in the NFL with 48 sacks in 2021.
11) 49ers were #3 in total defense.
12) Jimmy G. had a 98.7 passer rating this year, but a 102.9 in his last 10 regular season games.
13) Packers beat the 49ers 30-28 in game 3 of the regular season on a 51 yard walkoff field goal.
14) There will be a high of 21 degrees on Saturday. Game time is 5:15 local time.
No PI? Or no 5 yard rule? Can’t believe if they throws pass to a receiver and he’s tackled while ball is in air that it’s not PI.
Nonetheless, Norman didn’t play the gunner. He turned and headed back towards the returner. A major mental error. Niners should have kept their defense in and replaced a safety with Benjamin - on orders to fair catch.
The rule has to do with blocking, not tackling. Since the result of a punt is intended to be a fair catch or a return, the return team is expected to be either receiving the ball or blocking for the runner, and the kicking team is supposes to tackle and/or be blocked. The blocking expectation means that blocking contact is allowed on a fake, per NFL rules.
(01-18-2022, 10:21 AM)Phogge Wrote: Lance is not close. Smoke signals coming out of the Edward DeBartolo Senior Center in Santa Clara. But it doesn’t matter because Lex has already traded Jimmy and received Nick Mullins in return.
That's funny...in The Athletic, there's an article with players raving about Trey Lance's amazing success on the scout team.
(01-18-2022, 08:42 PM)lex24 Wrote: Niners grossly overpaid him based on a 5 game stretch of meaningless games. He was better before the knee injury. But I don’t know if he ever was a particularly accurate downfield passer. Great release. But not a downfield guy. Still, the contract is why he will be gone next year.
As for Shanahans offense, it’s run oriented with the pass game predicated on play action. Lance was in an offense at NDS that incorporated those elements. It’s folly to base much of anything on the tidbits we’ve seen so far. Rookie QBs are almost never successful. Learning NFL offenses and defenses take a while. Unless you are Andrew Luck. And savants don’t come around often.
Obviously Shanahan doesn’t want to have to throw him into the fray in a divisional playoff game. Probably wont have to. But thumb, plus shoulder isn’t good. What’s next - elbow?
FWLIW, Jimmy Garoppolo has the second highest road win percentage since the AFL/NFL merger (including playoffs) of any quarterback with 25 or more starts:
Patrick Mahomes, 26-7 (.788)
Jimmy Garoppolo, 20-6 (.769)
Joe Montana, 63-25 (.716)
And yet, I’m reading an article on the Panthers QB search. Writer says that Derek Carr would be an upgrade over Darnold. Garrapolo would not be. I disagree with that. But he’s carrying a $27 million cap hit around his neck. Which is why, Phogge, he will be gone and if traded they won’t get much (value of return will depend on how much of the 27 mill the Niners have to eat)
Good chance they will have to release him. That’s only a 1.4 million cap hit. It’s not JG’s fault that the Niners overpaid him. (I read that his cap hit is the highest percentage of any player in the league. Don’t know it that’s true. As there are several players with much higher salaries. But how they play the cap is, to say the least, confusing). He’s a solid QB in the 8 games or so a year that he’s actually healthy. But he’s not worth $27 million. And that, coupled with a franchise decision to trade multiple first rounders for Lance, leads to the obvious conclusion that he will be gone next year.
RE: lex24 - DC 86 - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 11:32 AM)lex24 Wrote: Good chance they will have to release him. That’s only a 1.4 million cap hit. It’s not JG’s fault that the Niners overpaid him. (I read that his cap hit is the highest percentage of any player in the league.). He’s a solid QB in the 8 games or so a year that he’s actually healthy. But he’s not worth anything close to $27 million. And that, coupled with a franchise decision to trade multiple first rounders for Lance, leads to the obvious conclusion that he will be gone next year.
Strongly disagree, there's a good market for him. His health is a wild card which could make him untradeable, but if he checks out physically his salary is actually reasonable relative to his ability, and there will be teams willing to give up a day two pick for him.
We have very different perceptions of his market so we'll have to wait and see. I do agree that he's likely playing elsewhere next year.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - Phogge - 01-22-2022
Shoot... of course on White. Although Jones had only one great year. I guess I was thinking of Jackie Brandt.
To Chub's credit he got Billy Pierce and Don Larsen for nothing. But they got rid of Leon Wagner, Jose Cardenal, Jose Pagan, Matty and Felipe. They got one good year from Bob Shaw.
Later on Horace sold Kingman to make payroll and lost Matthews. The Murcer trade was a disaster but Bobby Bonds had a problem that the Giants couldn't control. Maddox for Montanez if I remember was another disaster. Maddox and Willie Davis running first base to third was absolutely beautiful.
OK, what is the injury backup plan for Lance. Name names all you assistant GM's.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - DC 86 - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 11:48 AM)Phogge Wrote: OK, what is the injury backup plan for Lance. Name names all you assistant GM's.
Off the top of my head I'm not sure who is the best schematic fit for SF, but there will surely be multiple veteran options in the $5-$10 million/year range. Guys like Mariota, Brisett, Dalton, Taylor, Trubisky, etc. are upper tier backups and some will be available.
Basically every team is in trouble if their starting QB goes down, and no team can afford a starter-quality backup, it's just a risk you have to accept.
lex24 - lex24 - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 11:38 AM)DC 86 Wrote:(01-22-2022, 11:32 AM)lex24 Wrote: Good chance they will have to release him. That’s only a 1.4 million cap hit. It’s not JG’s fault that the Niners overpaid him. (I read that his cap hit is the highest percentage of any player in the league.). He’s a solid QB in the 8 games or so a year that he’s actually healthy. But he’s not worth anything close to $27 million. And that, coupled with a franchise decision to trade multiple first rounders for Lance, leads to the obvious conclusion that he will be gone next year.
Strongly disagree, there's a good market for him. His health is a wild card which could make him untradeable, but if he checks out physically his salary is actually reasonable relative to his ability, and there will be teams willing to give up a day two pick for him.
We have very different perceptions of his market so we'll have to wait and see. I do agree that he's likely playing elsewhere next year.
I hope you are right. Be more than happy to be wrong on this.
(01-22-2022, 11:48 AM)Phogge Wrote: Shoot... of course on White. Although Jones had only one great year. I guess I was thinking of Jackie Brandt.
To Chub's credit he got Billy Pierce and Don Larsen for nothing. But they got rid of Leon Wagner, Jose Cardenal, Jose Pagan, Matty and Felipe. They got one good year from Bob Shaw.
Later on Horace sold Kingman to make payroll and lost Matthews. The Murcer trade was a disaster but Bobby Bonds had a problem that the Giants couldn't control. Maddox for Montanez if I remember was another disaster. Maddox and Willie Davis running first base to third was absolutely beautiful.
OK, what is the injury backup plan for Lance. Name names all you assistant GM's.
Just a vivid reminder of how the Giants used to develop outfield talent. Just couldn’t keep it. Maddox was one of the most graceful baseball players I’ve seen. Sarge was the battering ram. And Bobby B was electric. Most underrated SF Giant.
As for backups next year DC gave a good list. Dalton would be my first choice.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - Giants - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 11:58 AM)DC 86 Wrote:(01-22-2022, 11:48 AM)Phogge Wrote: OK, what is the injury backup plan for Lance. Name names all you assistant GM's.
Off the top of my head I'm not sure who is the best schematic fit for SF, but there will surely be multiple veteran options in the $5-$10 million/year range. Guys like Mariota, Brisett, Dalton, Taylor, Trubisky, etc. are upper tier backups and some will be available.
Basically every team is in trouble if their starting QB goes down, and no team can afford a starter-quality backup, it's just a risk you have to accept.
Phogge: my Asst GM take on the matter (liberally borrowed from DC).
Garappolo for a 3 (with a performance-based proviso to 2)
Bring in a veteran to backup Lance - if available, Mariota since he and Lance play similar styles.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - Phogge - 01-22-2022
DC, I'd be satisfied with Mariota but not the others. I am in Jimmy's corner and hope to witness the dilemma of the Niners if they win the SB. Should be fun.
Lex, there are reasons for the Bonds trade and many of them rest on Bonds. But a Hall of Fame-headed career turned upside down. I was working for Horace at the time and Bonds was always great with us. Charlie Fox was a disaster of the greatest magnitude. Hated Gaylord, had been in love with McDowell since Sam's HS days. If we ever have that lunch I'll tell you a whopper of a story.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - lex24 - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 01:47 PM)Phogge Wrote: DC, I'd be satisfied with Mariota but not the others. I am in Jimmy's corner and hope to witness the dilemma of the Niners if they win the SB. Should be fun.
Lex, there are reasons for the Bonds trade and many of them rest on Bonds. But a Hall of Fame-headed career turned upside down. I was working for Horace at the time and Bonds was always great with us. Charlie Fox was a disaster of the greatest magnitude. Hated Gaylord, had been in love with McDowell since Sam's HS days. If we ever have that lunch I'll tell you a whopper of a story.
I’d love to see that dilemma!
As for lunch, just say the word.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - martyup - 01-22-2022
What a game in Green Bay!! Niners move on.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - cardcrimson - 01-22-2022
(01-22-2022, 09:11 PM)martyup Wrote: What a game in Green Bay!! Niners move on.
What a game? Probably the ugliest win in playoff history. But, a win is a win.
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - BobK - 01-22-2022
What a win. What an incredible win
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - cardcrimson - 01-22-2022
My daughter is a Niner good luck charm. She's watched less than 3 quarters of pro football this season. The second half against the Rams, and the last part of the fourth quarter against the Packers. . . .
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - Phogge - 01-22-2022
Jimmy threw some tomatoes but goddammit he wins. Compton is a disaster. Hufanga scored and he also covered the long pass in the 4th Q. A player. Another Polynesian safety from SC. Players of the game... Deebo and Armstead. DeForest Who?
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - BobK - 01-22-2022
We lost our outstanding DC to the Jets as Head coach. In October talking with friends we all thought new guy ain’t cutting it. We were so very wrong. What a defense
RE: Giants/Niners 2021 thread - old spanish trail - 01-22-2022
Deebo is Superman. I'm with ya Hogge re Jimmy. Would love to see the dilemma. Lex, is there any way out of the $27 mill problem?