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RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - cardcrimson - 01-22-2023
(01-22-2023, 01:50 PM)CompSci87 Wrote:(01-22-2023, 11:41 AM)BostonCard Wrote:(01-22-2023, 09:46 AM)BobK Wrote: Uh that’s a football team. Lol not baseball
Moved it to the miners thread.
BC
"A miner 49er and his daughter Clementine"?
Nice. Very nice!
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - BobK - 01-24-2023
Payroll info
https://www.knbr.com/2023/01/23/fast-facts-about-san-francisco-giants-2023-payroll/?fbclid=IwAR0KVGHWq6pUkigRlfAqvRXUpwO5wQ0AEwF_Uh8lCcIELd27CrsflLyn7Zc
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - lex24 - 01-25-2023
(01-24-2023, 04:34 PM)BobK Wrote: Payroll info
https://www.knbr.com/2023/01/23/fast-facts-about-san-francisco-giants-2023-payroll/?fbclid=IwAR0KVGHWq6pUkigRlfAqvRXUpwO5wQ0AEwF_Uh8lCcIELd27CrsflLyn7Zc
Waiting for Ohtani. $550,000,000. 15 years.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Giants - 01-29-2023
Good news for Mick…
Andrew Baggerly, who correctly predicted Fred McGriff’s first ballot HOF election by the Contemporary Baseball Era Committee, wrote that Jeff Kent will receive similar treatment when he comes up for consideration by the Committee in 2024.
As Baggerly stated - Kent before Bonds, “hilarity will ensue”…….
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - lex24 - 01-29-2023
(01-29-2023, 10:23 AM)Giants Wrote: Good news for Mick…
Andrew Baggerly, who correctly predicted Fred McGriff’s first ballot HOF election by the Contemporary Baseball Era Committee, wrote that Jeff Kent will receive similar treatment when he comes up for consideration by the Committee in 2024.
As Baggerly stated - Kent before Bonds, “hilarity will ensue”…….
Good. Kent should be in the Hall.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Mick - 01-29-2023
(01-29-2023, 11:20 AM)lex24 Wrote:(01-29-2023, 10:23 AM)Giants Wrote: Good news for Mick…
Andrew Baggerly, who correctly predicted Fred McGriff’s first ballot HOF election by the Contemporary Baseball Era Committee, wrote that Jeff Kent will receive similar treatment when he comes up for consideration by the Committee in 2024.
As Baggerly stated - Kent before Bonds, “hilarity will ensue”…….
Good. Kent should be in the Hall.
I think so too. Apparently the Giants essentially provided no support for Kent's campaign, still stinging from Kent lying about getting in a motorcycle accident, I'm sure among other things. I still thing Bonds should be in, PEDs or no.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Mick - 01-29-2023
Giants signed Roberto Perez as a backup catcher. Gold glove in 2019 and 2020 leading the league in throwing out base stealers both years, 24 HRs in 2019. Bad hamstring injury, out most of last year. OPS .700 last year. 34 years old.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - lex24 - 01-29-2023
[quote="Mick" pid='380726' dateline='1675034263']
Giants signed Roberto Perez as a backup catcher. Gold glove in 2019 and 2020 leading the league in throwing out base stealers both years, 24 HRs in 2019. Bad hamstring injury, out most of last year. OPS .700 last year. 34 years old.
[/quot
I see you quickly shifted back to baseball. Smart move!
As for the Giants – Zaidi just loves signing guys that have been out with long term injuries. It’s an added plus that he’s old…..
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Mick - 01-29-2023
(01-09-2023, 03:34 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:(01-09-2023, 08:30 AM)lex24 Wrote: Still. I get to some, Zaidi can do no wrong…….
And who would they be? Anyone here? Certainly not the talking heads on the radio--even Krukow was taking some mild shots after the departure of Sabean. . . .
Sabean was a lot of fun. During his career, his Giants teams won 53.4% of their games, not quite as good as Farhan's 53.8%.
Sabean's first four years were slightly better, at 55.6%. Sabean came in after four years of Bob Quinn's wreckage, and Farhan came in after three years of Bobby Evans' wreckage who, like Quinn, had a great first year followed by a very steady decline. I don't know about the minor league system when Sabean took over, but when Farhan came in, the top three minor league affiliates of the Giants finished last in their leagues. AAA, AA, A (SJ) were all dead last in their league or divisions.
This year should be interesting.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - lex24 - 01-29-2023
(01-29-2023, 08:37 PM)Mick Wrote:(01-09-2023, 03:34 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:(01-09-2023, 08:30 AM)lex24 Wrote: Still. I get to some, Zaidi can do no wrong…….
And who would they be? Anyone here? Certainly not the talking heads on the radio--even Krukow was taking some mild shots after the departure of Sabean. . . .
Sabean was a lot of fun. During his career, his Giants teams won 53.4% of their games, not quite as good as Farhan's 53.8%.
Sabean's first four years were slightly better, at 55.6%. Sabean came in after four years of Bob Quinn's wreckage, and Farhan came in after three years of Bobby Evans' wreckage who, like Quinn, had a great first year followed by a very steady decline. I don't know about the minor league system when Sabean took over, but when Farhan came in, the top three minor league affiliates of the Giants finished last in their leagues. AAA, AA, A (SJ) were all dead last in their league or divisions.
This year should be interesting.
Not quite sure what this is responding to. Also, not quite sure of the significance of comparing their first couple of years. Sabean has about a 40 year body of work to look at - 29 with the Giants.
Baggerly wrote a bit about how he was cast off. Essentially ignored by Zaidi and Co. Which to me is the height of arrogance. Why bother to listen to (or even consult with) a guy that’s twice built Championship level teams and did so with two very different approaches. (Sabean, as the Yankees Scouting director also help build the team with Jeter, Posada, Rivera and Pettitte in the 90’s) A baseball man that presided over the only 3 WS winners the organization has had in 64 years? I mean I’m sure he has limited computer skills.
Do you wanna know how badly they disrespected Sabean? The Giants ‘22 media guide had a bio page on the Giants minor league emotional comfort dog. They had nothing on Sabean.
I get the impression, which, admittedly, may be wrong, that this current front office just thinks they’re smarter than everybody else. A bunch of mathematicians. Baseball by mathematicians and computer programs.
Time will tell. I’m becoming dubious.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - cardcrimson - 01-29-2023
(01-29-2023, 08:54 PM)lex24 Wrote:(01-29-2023, 08:37 PM)Mick Wrote:(01-09-2023, 03:34 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:(01-09-2023, 08:30 AM)lex24 Wrote: Still. I get to some, Zaidi can do no wrong…….
And who would they be? Anyone here? Certainly not the talking heads on the radio--even Krukow was taking some mild shots after the departure of Sabean. . . .
Sabean was a lot of fun. During his career, his Giants teams won 53.4% of their games, not quite as good as Farhan's 53.8%.
Sabean's first four years were slightly better, at 55.6%. Sabean came in after four years of Bob Quinn's wreckage, and Farhan came in after three years of Bobby Evans' wreckage who, like Quinn, had a great first year followed by a very steady decline. I don't know about the minor league system when Sabean took over, but when Farhan came in, the top three minor league affiliates of the Giants finished last in their leagues. AAA, AA, A (SJ) were all dead last in their league or divisions.
This year should be interesting.
Not quite sure what this is responding to. Also, not quite sure of the significance of comparing their first couple of years. Sabean has about a 40 year body of work to look at - 29 with the Giants.
Baggerly wrote a bit about how he was cast off. Essentially ignored by Zaidi and Co. Which to me is the height of arrogance. Why bother to listen to (or even consult with) a guy that’s twice built Championship level teams and did so with two very different approaches. (Sabean, as the Yankees Scouting director also help build the team with Jeter, Posada, Rivera and Pettitte in the 90’s) A baseball man that presided over the only 3 WS winners the organization has had in 64 years? I mean I’m sure he has limited computer skills.
Do you wanna know how badly they disrespected Sabean? The Giants ‘22 media guide had a bio page on the Giants minor league emotional comfort dog. They had nothing on Sabean.
I get the impression, which, admittedly, may be wrong, that this current front office just thinks they’re smarter than everybody else. A bunch of mathematicians. Baseball by mathematicians and computer programs.
Time will tell. I’m becoming dubious.
Wow. A group of people who think they are smarter than everybody else around. In honor of unnamed former participant here, let's just leave that astute observation hanging out there for awhile.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - lex24 - 01-30-2023
(01-29-2023, 11:13 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:(01-29-2023, 08:54 PM)lex24 Wrote:(01-29-2023, 08:37 PM)Mick Wrote:(01-09-2023, 03:34 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:(01-09-2023, 08:30 AM)lex24 Wrote: Still. I get to some, Zaidi can do no wrong…….
And who would they be? Anyone here? Certainly not the talking heads on the radio--even Krukow was taking some mild shots after the departure of Sabean. . . .
Sabean was a lot of fun. During his career, his Giants teams won 53.4% of their games, not quite as good as Farhan's 53.8%.
Sabean's first four years were slightly better, at 55.6%. Sabean came in after four years of Bob Quinn's wreckage, and Farhan came in after three years of Bobby Evans' wreckage who, like Quinn, had a great first year followed by a very steady decline. I don't know about the minor league system when Sabean took over, but when Farhan came in, the top three minor league affiliates of the Giants finished last in their leagues. AAA, AA, A (SJ) were all dead last in their league or divisions.
This year should be interesting.
Not quite sure what this is responding to. Also, not quite sure of the significance of comparing their first couple of years. Sabean has about a 40 year body of work to look at - 29 with the Giants.
Baggerly wrote a bit about how he was cast off. Essentially ignored by Zaidi and Co. Which to me is the height of arrogance. Why bother to listen to (or even consult with) a guy that’s twice built Championship level teams and did so with two very different approaches. (Sabean, as the Yankees Scouting director also help build the team with Jeter, Posada, Rivera and Pettitte in the 90’s) A baseball man that presided over the only 3 WS winners the organization has had in 64 years? I mean I’m sure he has limited computer skills.
Do you wanna know how badly they disrespected Sabean? The Giants ‘22 media guide had a bio page on the Giants minor league emotional comfort dog. They had nothing on Sabean.
I get the impression, which, admittedly, may be wrong, that this current front office just thinks they’re smarter than everybody else. A bunch of mathematicians. Baseball by mathematicians and computer programs.
Time will tell. I’m becoming dubious.
Wow. A group of people who think they are smarter than everybody else around. In honor of unnamed former participant here, let's just leave that astute observation hanging out there for awhile.
Free Phogge.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - lex24 - 02-03-2023
Not a Keith Law fan. But he does follow farm systems closely. His rankings came out. Dodgers #1. Giants #19. I’m depressed…..
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Giants - 02-03-2023
(02-03-2023, 08:42 AM)lex24 Wrote: Not a Keith Law fan. But he does follow farm systems closely. His rankings came out. Dodgers #1. Giants #19. I’m depressed…..
…and I thought it was a fair assessment of the current situation. This is becoming a make or break season at the minor league level for a bunch of guys. Matos, Bishop, Bailey top that list.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - lex24 - 02-03-2023
(02-03-2023, 12:12 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 08:42 AM)lex24 Wrote: Not a Keith Law fan. But he does follow farm systems closely. His rankings came out. Dodgers #1. Giants #19. I’m depressed…..
…and I thought it was a fair assessment of the current situation. This is becoming a make or break season at the minor league level for a bunch of guys. Matos, Bishop, Bailey top that list.
I’d say it’s an important year for Matos. . But not make her break is still awfully young. He also had a nice last month offensively. And apparently is always good defensively. Bishop and Bailey I agree with you. Add Ramos – although he may already be a break.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Giants - 02-03-2023
(02-03-2023, 01:54 PM)lex24 Wrote:(02-03-2023, 12:12 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 08:42 AM)lex24 Wrote: Not a Keith Law fan. But he does follow farm systems closely. His rankings came out. Dodgers #1. Giants #19. I’m depressed…..
…and I thought it was a fair assessment of the current situation. This is becoming a make or break season at the minor league level for a bunch of guys. Matos, Bishop, Bailey top that list.
I’d say it’s an important year for Matos. . But not make her break is still awfully young. He also had a nice last month offensively. And apparently is always good defensively. Bishop and Bailey I agree with you. Add Ramos – although he may already be a break.
Ramos - the ship has sailed and he is still on the dock. The unfortunate thing is his trade value is nil. Chili Davis’ status as the last homegrown OF all-star is safe for now. Darn….
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Mick - 02-04-2023
(02-03-2023, 05:32 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 01:54 PM)lex24 Wrote:(02-03-2023, 12:12 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 08:42 AM)lex24 Wrote: Not a Keith Law fan. But he does follow farm systems closely. His rankings came out. Dodgers #1. Giants #19. I’m depressed…..
…and I thought it was a fair assessment of the current situation. This is becoming a make or break season at the minor league level for a bunch of guys. Matos, Bishop, Bailey top that list.
I’d say it’s an important year for Matos. . But not make her break is still awfully young. He also had a nice last month offensively. And apparently is always good defensively. Bishop and Bailey I agree with you. Add Ramos – although he may already be a break.
Ramos - the ship has sailed and he is still on the dock. The unfortunate thing is his trade value is nil. Chili Davis’ status as the last homegrown OF all-star is safe for now. Darn….
Well, they did draft Bryan Reynolds, and he was an All Star...albeit for the Pirates. He's still a Pirate, BTW, though he doesn't want to be. He's in the last year of a $6.75 million contract and is arbitration eligible next year. He'd make a great Giant again, though the Giants would probably have to give up either Slater or Yaz and probably Matos and Luciano. What the heck, throw in Bishop, Bailey and Wilson, too...
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - lex24 - 02-04-2023
(02-04-2023, 10:14 AM)Mick Wrote:(02-03-2023, 05:32 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 01:54 PM)lex24 Wrote:(02-03-2023, 12:12 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 08:42 AM)lex24 Wrote: Not a Keith Law fan. But he does follow farm systems closely. His rankings came out. Dodgers #1. Giants #19. I’m depressed…..
…and I thought it was a fair assessment of the current situation. This is becoming a make or break season at the minor league level for a bunch of guys. Matos, Bishop, Bailey top that list.
I’d say it’s an important year for Matos. . But not make her break is still awfully young. He also had a nice last month offensively. And apparently is always good defensively. Bishop and Bailey I agree with you. Add Ramos – although he may already be a break.
Ramos - the ship has sailed and he is still on the dock. The unfortunate thing is his trade value is nil. Chili Davis’ status as the last homegrown OF all-star is safe for now. Darn….
Well, they did draft Bryan Reynolds, and he was an All Star...albeit for the Pirates. He's still a Pirate, BTW, though he doesn't want to be. He's in the last year of a $6.75 million contract and is arbitration eligible next year. He'd make a great Giant again, though the Giants would probably have to give up either Slater or Yaz and probably Matos and Luciano. What the heck, throw in Bishop, Bailey and Wilson, too...
There is no way I would include Luciano in a trade for Brian Reynolds.
(02-03-2023, 05:32 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 01:54 PM)lex24 Wrote:(02-03-2023, 12:12 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 08:42 AM)lex24 Wrote: Not a Keith Law fan. But he does follow farm systems closely. His rankings came out. Dodgers #1. Giants #19. I’m depressed…..
…and I thought it was a fair assessment of the current situation. This is becoming a make or break season at the minor league level for a bunch of guys. Matos, Bishop, Bailey top that list.
I’d say it’s an important year for Matos. . But not make her break is still awfully young. He also had a nice last month offensively. And apparently is always good defensively. Bishop and Bailey I agree with you. Add Ramos – although he may already be a break.
Ramos - the ship has sailed and he is still on the dock. The unfortunate thing is his trade value is nil. Chili Davis’ status as the last homegrown OF all-star is safe for now. Darn….
He’s still only 23. And he played above age level for quite some time. So I haven’t completely given up on him. It certainly does not appear that he is going to be any type of “star.” It does not mean however, he can’t be a major league serviceable player. I agree with you on the trade value.
You mentioned Matos earlier as being in a make or break here. Consider the fact that he’s only 21 and he’ll probably be playing AA. He’ll be a few years younger than the average age level. I do think that matters a little bit.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Giants - 02-04-2023
(02-04-2023, 10:20 AM)lex24 Wrote:(02-04-2023, 10:14 AM)Mick Wrote:(02-03-2023, 05:32 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 01:54 PM)lex24 Wrote:(02-03-2023, 12:12 PM)Giants Wrote: …and I thought it was a fair assessment of the current situation. This is becoming a make or break season at the minor league level for a bunch of guys. Matos, Bishop, Bailey top that list.
I’d say it’s an important year for Matos. . But not make her break is still awfully young. He also had a nice last month offensively. And apparently is always good defensively. Bishop and Bailey I agree with you. Add Ramos – although he may already be a break.
Ramos - the ship has sailed and he is still on the dock. The unfortunate thing is his trade value is nil. Chili Davis’ status as the last homegrown OF all-star is safe for now. Darn….
Well, they did draft Bryan Reynolds, and he was an All Star...albeit for the Pirates. He's still a Pirate, BTW, though he doesn't want to be. He's in the last year of a $6.75 million contract and is arbitration eligible next year. He'd make a great Giant again, though the Giants would probably have to give up either Slater or Yaz and probably Matos and Luciano. What the heck, throw in Bishop, Bailey and Wilson, too...
There is no way I would include Luciano in a trade for Brian Reynolds.
(02-03-2023, 05:32 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 01:54 PM)lex24 Wrote:(02-03-2023, 12:12 PM)Giants Wrote:(02-03-2023, 08:42 AM)lex24 Wrote: Not a Keith Law fan. But he does follow farm systems closely. His rankings came out. Dodgers #1. Giants #19. I’m depressed…..
…and I thought it was a fair assessment of the current situation. This is becoming a make or break season at the minor league level for a bunch of guys. Matos, Bishop, Bailey top that list.
I’d say it’s an important year for Matos. . But not make her break is still awfully young. He also had a nice last month offensively. And apparently is always good defensively. Bishop and Bailey I agree with you. Add Ramos – although he may already be a break.
Ramos - the ship has sailed and he is still on the dock. The unfortunate thing is his trade value is nil. Chili Davis’ status as the last homegrown OF all-star is safe for now. Darn….
He’s still only 23. And he played above age level for quite some time. So I haven’t completely given up on him. It certainly does not appear that he is going to be any type of “star.” It does not mean however, he can’t be a major league serviceable player. I agree with you on the trade value.
You mentioned Matos earlier as being in a make or break here. Consider the fact that he’s only 21 and he’ll probably be playing AA. He’ll be a few years younger than the average age level. I do think that matters a little bit.
At some point, you gotta put up some numbers and force your way on to the scene. This is the year for Matos. Make Zaidi move you to the front of the line. Sure he could continue a steady rise through the system, make the big club’s roster some day and become a journeyman. However, if Matos is to become a star player, I think this is the year he needs to get our attention.
RE: OT: Giants 2023 thread - Mick - 02-04-2023
Final thoughts on Correa, and the collective fan reaction to homegrowing players.
With respect to Correa, Jon Heyman of the New York Post made some interesting claims:
1) One of the doctors -- presumably either the SF Giants doctor or the NY Mets doctor -- said that Correa's ankle was "the worst they'd ever seen." My guess is the Mets' doctor, given that this was a WFAN.
2) Correa won the Platinum Glove in 2021, was 5th in MVP voting, had an .850 OPS and was just 26 and should theoretically have been in line for a brobdingnagian payday. But he "only" got a three year deal...which he backed out of after the first year. Could there have been MLB-wide cognizance of his physical shortcomings?
3) Houston was willing to let him go after 2021 for...frankly...not all that much.
Giants made the right decision on Correa.
With respect to homegrowing players...this has been gnawing at the back of my head for a while. I keep hearing and reading about local Giants fans preferences for homegrowing players rather than bringing them in through trade or free agency. To my mind, if the Giants win 107 games, who cares where the players come from?
And then I thought about the popular homegrown Giants that led to the 2010, 12 and 14 WCS victors. Posey. Bumgarner. Cain. Lincecum. Belt. Crawford. Vogelsong. Panik. Duffy -- to say nothing of secondary draftees like Otero, Osich, Black, Runzler, Culberson, Wheeler, Reynolds, Gillaspie, Heston, Stratton, Susac, Crick, Tomlinson, Law, Okert, Blach, Beede, Rogers, Arroyo, Baragar, Menez, Duvall, Parker, Hembree, Williamson. All Caucasians. And a lot of the key players in 2021 were not Caucasian; e.g., Flores, Dubon, Solano, Wade, Estrada, Doval, Garcia, Tromp, Davis, Sanchez, Alvarez, Quintana, Peralta, Jackson, Santos, Moronta, Castro.
And of course, the white GM, Sabean and Quinn was replaced by a Muslim, Farhan Zaidi.
Could there be a little bit of racism in the collective Giants fan community? Just wondering.