Stanford to Big10? - Printable Version

Stanford to Big10? - Printable Version

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RE: Stanford to Big10? - cardcrimson - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 05:20 PM)Jamesy Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:07 PM)chrisk Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:55 PM)gocard14 Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:36 PM)chrisk Wrote: It is interesting how fast some Stanford fans are willing to sell out.

How much does Stanford need another $5-$10M in TV money? In the big picture of things,
it seems like a small return for being a second class citizen in the Big 10.

There would likely be limitations on FB and BB games between the 4 latecomers and USC and UCLA
because much of the incremenental value of USC and UCLA is the games between them and the Midwest schools.

What is the alternative? The Pac12 is cooked. With more lucrative rights deals in the Big10 and Big12, schools will be gobbled up until only the undesirables remain. If we don't get into the Big10, we may be left trying to create a conference out of WSU, OSU, us, Cal, and mountain west schools. Or we get into a Big12 that shares no academic values and is a geographic nightmare. Or we join the mountain west.

The best possible outcome is that we end up as part of a Big10 west that semi-resembles the Pac8. We get the money of the Big10, occasional fun games against some Big10 heavyweights, keep our old rivalries, keep travel reasonable for most of our sports, etc. The Big10 championship game is essentially the new rose bowl, and can (hopefully) be played in the Rose Bowl.

You continue to assume the Big 10 will make an offer and if they do, the offer would be acceptable.
UO and UW have gone hat in hand to the Big 10. What kind of deal is a beggar going to receive in this situation?
How long will these former Pac 10 schools be satisfied being second-class citizens? The Big 10 pie is already being split 16 ways and old-line Big 10 schools are leary of splitting it even further.

A half share in the big ten is 20-25% more money than what the new pac 12 deal is projected to be. With progressive escalators annually it'll give the school way more money than staying in the pac x. A six team pacific division would be a great fit.

Money over tradition. Love it!

RE: Stanford to Big10? - Jamesy - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 05:38 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:20 PM)Jamesy Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:07 PM)chrisk Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:55 PM)gocard14 Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:36 PM)chrisk Wrote: It is interesting how fast some Stanford fans are willing to sell out.

How much does Stanford need another $5-$10M in TV money? In the big picture of things,
it seems like a small return for being a second class citizen in the Big 10.

There would likely be limitations on FB and BB games between the 4 latecomers and USC and UCLA
because much of the incremenental value of USC and UCLA is the games between them and the Midwest schools.

What is the alternative? The Pac12 is cooked. With more lucrative rights deals in the Big10 and Big12, schools will be gobbled up until only the undesirables remain. If we don't get into the Big10, we may be left trying to create a conference out of WSU, OSU, us, Cal, and mountain west schools. Or we get into a Big12 that shares no academic values and is a geographic nightmare. Or we join the mountain west.

The best possible outcome is that we end up as part of a Big10 west that semi-resembles the Pac8. We get the money of the Big10, occasional fun games against some Big10 heavyweights, keep our old rivalries, keep travel reasonable for most of our sports, etc. The Big10 championship game is essentially the new rose bowl, and can (hopefully) be played in the Rose Bowl.

You continue to assume the Big 10 will make an offer and if they do, the offer would be acceptable.
UO and UW have gone hat in hand to the Big 10. What kind of deal is a beggar going to receive in this situation?
How long will these former Pac 10 schools be satisfied being second-class citizens? The Big 10 pie is already being split 16 ways and old-line Big 10 schools are leary of splitting it even further.

A half share in the big ten is 20-25% more money than what the new pac 12 deal is projected to be. With progressive escalators annually it'll give the school way more money than staying in the pac x. A six team pacific division would be a great fit.

Money over tradition. Love it!

If Oregon and UW are both gone there is no tradition or conference to cling to.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - Softball Fan - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 05:38 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:20 PM)Jamesy Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:07 PM)chrisk Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:55 PM)gocard14 Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:36 PM)chrisk Wrote: It is interesting how fast some Stanford fans are willing to sell out.

How much does Stanford need another $5-$10M in TV money? In the big picture of things,
it seems like a small return for being a second class citizen in the Big 10.

There would likely be limitations on FB and BB games between the 4 latecomers and USC and UCLA
because much of the incremenental value of USC and UCLA is the games between them and the Midwest schools.

What is the alternative? The Pac12 is cooked. With more lucrative rights deals in the Big10 and Big12, schools will be gobbled up until only the undesirables remain. If we don't get into the Big10, we may be left trying to create a conference out of WSU, OSU, us, Cal, and mountain west schools. Or we get into a Big12 that shares no academic values and is a geographic nightmare. Or we join the mountain west.

The best possible outcome is that we end up as part of a Big10 west that semi-resembles the Pac8. We get the money of the Big10, occasional fun games against some Big10 heavyweights, keep our old rivalries, keep travel reasonable for most of our sports, etc. The Big10 championship game is essentially the new rose bowl, and can (hopefully) be played in the Rose Bowl.

You continue to assume the Big 10 will make an offer and if they do, the offer would be acceptable.
UO and UW have gone hat in hand to the Big 10. What kind of deal is a beggar going to receive in this situation?
How long will these former Pac 10 schools be satisfied being second-class citizens? The Big 10 pie is already being split 16 ways and old-line Big 10 schools are leary of splitting it even further.

A half share in the big ten is 20-25% more money than what the new pac 12 deal is projected to be. With progressive escalators annually it'll give the school way more money than staying in the pac x. A six team pacific division would be a great fit.

Money over tradition. Love it!

If you don't want the athletic department to look again at cutting a bunch of sports, then you better put a pretty high priority on money. At some point an institution must face reality and accept the times they are a-changin'.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - george - 08-02-2023

Apologies if this article from yahoo covers the same ground, but there was this ominous thought at the end:

Quote:Then there is Notre Dame, a proud independent who could finally feel pushed to join a league full-time.me.

You know what would be worse than the Big 10 taking UW and UO? The Big 10 taking UW, UO, C.al, and ND. That would hurt.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - cardcrimson - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 06:20 PM)paloalto Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:38 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:20 PM)Jamesy Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:07 PM)chrisk Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:55 PM)gocard14 Wrote: What is the alternative? The Pac12 is cooked. With more lucrative rights deals in the Big10 and Big12, schools will be gobbled up until only the undesirables remain. If we don't get into the Big10, we may be left trying to create a conference out of WSU, OSU, us, Cal, and mountain west schools. Or we get into a Big12 that shares no academic values and is a geographic nightmare. Or we join the mountain west.

The best possible outcome is that we end up as part of a Big10 west that semi-resembles the Pac8. We get the money of the Big10, occasional fun games against some Big10 heavyweights, keep our old rivalries, keep travel reasonable for most of our sports, etc. The Big10 championship game is essentially the new rose bowl, and can (hopefully) be played in the Rose Bowl.

You continue to assume the Big 10 will make an offer and if they do, the offer would be acceptable.
UO and UW have gone hat in hand to the Big 10. What kind of deal is a beggar going to receive in this situation?
How long will these former Pac 10 schools be satisfied being second-class citizens? The Big 10 pie is already being split 16 ways and old-line Big 10 schools are leary of splitting it even further.

A half share in the big ten is 20-25% more money than what the new pac 12 deal is projected to be. With progressive escalators annually it'll give the school way more money than staying in the pac x. A six team pacific division would be a great fit.

Money over tradition. Love it!

If you don't want the athletic department to look again at cutting a bunch of sports, then you better put a pretty high priority on money. At some point an institution must face reality and accept the times they are a-changin'.

Stanford has a multibillion dollar endowment. I hadn't been on the campus, at least on the academic side for a while. On several recent visits, I was aghast at the opulence of the new engineering buildings. Why? Do granite and marble edifices enhance learning? I think no.

Athletics, time and time again have been shown to enhance the overall student experience. So I chose athletes over granite, every day of the week.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - 82lsju - 08-02-2023

FSU and Clemson to the Big Ten??

https://www.tallahassee.com/story/sports/college/fsu/2023/08/01/fsu-big-10-what-we-know-acc-conference-realignment/70506689007/

Quote:According to college football insider Greg Swaim, Florida State will negotiate a $300 million buyout to exit the ACC.

https://www.sportskeeda.com/college-football/300-million-buyout-line-florida-state-leaving-acc-noles-reap-2x-profits-program-joins-big-ten-sec-reports

RE: Stanford to Big10? - Softball Fan - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 06:43 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 06:20 PM)paloalto Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:38 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:20 PM)Jamesy Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 05:07 PM)chrisk Wrote: You continue to assume the Big 10 will make an offer and if they do, the offer would be acceptable.
UO and UW have gone hat in hand to the Big 10. What kind of deal is a beggar going to receive in this situation?
How long will these former Pac 10 schools be satisfied being second-class citizens? The Big 10 pie is already being split 16 ways and old-line Big 10 schools are leary of splitting it even further.

A half share in the big ten is 20-25% more money than what the new pac 12 deal is projected to be. With progressive escalators annually it'll give the school way more money than staying in the pac x. A six team pacific division would be a great fit.

Money over tradition. Love it!

If you don't want the athletic department to look again at cutting a bunch of sports, then you better put a pretty high priority on money. At some point an institution must face reality and accept the times they are a-changin'.

Stanford has a multibillion dollar endowment. I hadn't been on the campus, at least on the academic side for a while. On several recent visits, I was aghast at the opulence of the new engineering buildings. Why? Do granite and marble edifices enhance learning? I think no.

Athletics, time and time again have been shown to enhance the overall student experience. So I chose athletes over granite, every day of the week.

Yes, except almost all of that endowment is dedicated for a particular use and the small amount that isn't has to be used to help annual operating expenses to keep the doors open. If it was as simple as taking money from the endowment don't you think the athletic department would have done that rather than cut so many sports programs.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - jacket3ree - 08-02-2023

It is like a utility connection fee.

Better than any other option that seems to be feasible at this point. Plus Wolverines and Buckeyes are occasionally in Palo Alto and Berkeley. How cool is that?

SC and UCLA leaving were the death knell for the PacX. If Oregon and UDub are also gone without Stanford, that is grave robbery.

(08-02-2023, 02:36 PM)chrisk Wrote: It is interesting how fast some Stanford fans are willing to sell out.

How much does Stanford need another $5-$10M in TV money? In the big picture of things,
it seems like a small return for being a second class citizen in the Big 10.

There would likely be limitations on FB and BB games between the 4 latecomers and USC and UCLA
because much of the incremenental value of USC and UCLA is the games between them and the Midwest schools.

We're not selling out for TV money; we are selling out for relevancy. And the money that comes with relevancy.

Washington State, Oregon State, Cal, Stanford and who exactly? Non Big-Game crowds of 10,000 maybe? Big Game all but dead in Conference Doldrums? No thanks.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - OutsiderFan - 08-02-2023

It seemed inevitable that FSU, Miami, and Clemson would join the SEC. But this FSU story is nuts.

The question is who else would be added to be #20? Louisville? TCU? I don’t see UNC or Duke being a fit. Maybe Virginia Tech?

If the SEC does go to 20, you’d think the Big Ten would want to add four to get to 20 itself.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - norcard10 - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 02:50 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote: Don't forget the value Cal, Stanford, and Washington would bring the Big Ten academic research consortium. That factors into the equation for the Big Ten.

In terms of overall value to the Big Ten, I'd rank as follows:

1. Washington - Best combo of Football strength and academic research, big market
2. Stanford - Best school in D1, credible Football, big market, great brand
3. Oregon - Big Football school and Nike
4. Cal - Nobel prizes, not atrocious Football, big market and alumni base

The academic consortium plays second fiddle here. Way overestimating stanford's importance or desirability relative to Oregon as well.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - jacket3ree - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 05:38 PM)cardcrimson Wrote: Money over tradition. Love it!

My favorite Dire Straits album.

RE: Mudhead - norcard10 - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 05:19 PM)Mudhead Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:25 PM)Leftcoast Wrote: Let's see .... Stanford gets as little as 50% while the LA traitors get a full payout? And the remaining Pac 12 schools are left homeless with nothing. Western regional college sports are driven into a outpost ghetto of the Southern and Mid-Western schools. Do I have that right? We no longer need to talk about something as simple as an Eastern bias. We can begin talking about West Coast subjugation.

I suppose we'd be foolish not to jump on that opportunity but it tastes bitter. Very, very bitter.

Sometimes I wonder why my love for college sports wavers but moments like this mean I don't wonder for very long.

You have it exactly right. When you don’t emphasize the revenue sports but focus on the Directors Cup, when you shut down hard for .Covid while the rest of the athletic world plays and when you have a third rate Commissioner who enriches himself but fails in every way in his job this is where you wind up.

I take solace in the fact that a 50% share of Big 10 media revenues is far more than the reported $20m we would get from a new PAC? Share and considerably more than we are getting now. We were in a stronger position a year ago and we are in a stronger position now than we will be in a year. We made very bad decisions and have lost the war. We could do an old South thing and fight on forever or accept reality and move on. As some one else said, it’s time to play the long game and not make future athletes and fans pay for continued errors of judgement,

Let’s just hope the Big 10 includes us. The SEC won’t and thee are only two games in town.

Glad someone realizes it. Winning in water polo or gymnastics isnt going to matter if football and basketball remain in doldrums

RE: Stanford to Big10? - OutsiderFan - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 07:08 PM)norcard10 Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:50 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote: Don't forget the value Cal, Stanford, and Washington would bring the Big Ten academic research consortium. That factors into the equation for the Big Ten.

In terms of overall value to the Big Ten, I'd rank as follows:

1. Washington - Best combo of Football strength and academic research, big market
2. Stanford - Best school in D1, credible Football, big market, great brand
3. Oregon - Big Football school and Nike
4. Cal - Nobel prizes, not atrocious Football, big market and alumni base

The academic consortium plays second fiddle here. Way overestimating stanford's importance or desirability relative to Oregon as well.

This is contradicted by the fact the reporting is the Big Ten Presidents prefer adding Cal and Stanford while Fox doesn’t. I’ve seen some analyses that rate Cal and Stanford more valuable than Washington and Oregon, but it depends on the metrics used and what is being valued specifically.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - jacket3ree - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 07:04 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote: It seemed inevitable that FSU, Miami, and Clemson would join the SEC. But this FSU story is nuts.

The question is who else would be added to be #20? Louisville? TCU? I don’t see UNC or Duke being a fit. Maybe Virginia Tech?

If the SEC does go to 20, you’d think the Big Ten would want to add four to get to 20 itself.

Never underestimate the 'Noles ability to do something monumentally stupid.

Or as GoJacketsInRaleigh says: "F FSU. I say take their exit fee and 100% of their TV money through 2036 and they can go piss off."

RE: Stanford to Big10? - norcard10 - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 07:14 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 07:08 PM)norcard10 Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:50 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote: Don't forget the value Cal, Stanford, and Washington would bring the Big Ten academic research consortium. That factors into the equation for the Big Ten.

In terms of overall value to the Big Ten, I'd rank as follows:

1. Washington - Best combo of Football strength and academic research, big market
2. Stanford - Best school in D1, credible Football, big market, great brand
3. Oregon - Big Football school and Nike
4. Cal - Nobel prizes, not atrocious Football, big market and alumni base

The academic consortium plays second fiddle here. Way overestimating stanford's importance or desirability relative to Oregon as well.

This is contradicted by the fact the reporting is the Big Ten Presidents prefer adding Cal and Stanford while Fox doesn’t. I’ve seen some analyses that rate Cal and Stanford more valuable than Washington and Oregon, but it depends on the metrics used and what is being valued specifically.

https://theathletic.com/4743596/2023/08/02/big-ten-expansion-pac-12-realignment/

Very clearly says Stanford and Cal are in the second group in versus Oregon and UDub

RE: Stanford to Big10? - needle - 08-02-2023

Quote: The Big Ten's discussions are centered on Washington and Oregon, sources told ESPN.

...

Quote: Although there's some presidential interest in adding Cal and Stanford, those potential additions were met with chilly responses last year when the Big Ten pondered adding more teams, in part because of their lack of television resonance. Stanford's addition to the Big Ten has long been paired to a potential Notre Dame addition, which doesn't appear imminent at this point.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/38123037/big-ten-explores-possible-expansion-amid-pac-12-instability

I think it is time to gameplan the doomsday scenarios. Stanford as a football independent and member of the Big Sky or Big West?

RE: Stanford to Big10? - dabigv13 - 08-02-2023

Football independent versus some mix of OSU, WSU, cal, SDSU, Nevada, SJSU, Fresno State, Boise State....

Yeah, I think independent is better.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - Jamesy - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 07:44 PM)dabigv13 Wrote: Football independent versus some mix of OSU, WSU, cal, SDSU, Nevada, SJSU, Fresno State, Boise State....

Yeah, I think independent is better.

Being independent is great in theory but terrible in reality. You have to negotiate your own tv contract and no network is going to give Stanford as an independent anywhere close to what even mwc schools get from their contract. You need a large passionate fan base like notre dame or byu who can get a good tv deal to survive as an independent. Sad to say but everything boils down to money here.

RE: Stanford to Big10? - dabigv13 - 08-02-2023

Say we schedule SC or UCLA (or Michigan or Northwestern). Do we get an even split of whatever ESPN or Fox or CBS pays for that game?

RE: Stanford to Big10? - old spanish trail - 08-02-2023

(08-02-2023, 02:55 PM)gocard14 Wrote:
(08-02-2023, 02:36 PM)chrisk Wrote: It is interesting how fast some Stanford fans are willing to sell out.

How much does Stanford need another $5-$10M in TV money? In the big picture of things,
it seems like a small return for being a second class citizen in the Big 10.

There would likely be limitations on FB and BB games between the 4 latecomers and USC and UCLA
because much of the incremenental value of USC and UCLA is the games between them and the Midwest schools.

What is the alternative? The Pac12 is cooked. With more lucrative rights deals in the Big10 and Big12, schools will be gobbled up until only the undesirables remain. If we don't get into the Big10, we may be left trying to create a conference out of WSU, OSU, us, Cal, and mountain west schools. Or we get into a Big12 that shares no academic values and is a geographic nightmare. Or we join the mountain west.

The best possible outcome is that we end up as part of a Big10 west that semi-resembles the Pac8. We get the money of the Big10, occasional fun games against some Big10 heavyweights, keep our old rivalries, keep travel reasonable for most of our sports, etc. The Big10 championship game is essentially the new rose bowl, and can (hopefully) be played in the Rose Bowl.

Yep.